The Quakers "fight" by absorbing punishment and abuse, like a Lamb. It really is the way of the cross to defeat evil. This suffering love way of fighting became known as, already in the Cromwell days, a "lamb's war."
They waged it in the New England colonies in the new world, absorbing all sorts of physical violence from the Puritans who wanted a "pure church." But they just kept coming. Eventually, that way of thinking won out. The Puritans developed a "half way convenant" and then also later came round to Roger Williams ideas. (Roger btw was a real Anabaptist. He was rebaptized by an Anabaptist that discipled him. This influence was behind is advocacy for freedom of religion in the colonies...and then specifically in Rhode Island. And later this self same idea, manifested in the nascent federal state. So one can make a cogent argument that Anabaptism is to thank for the current "Freedom of Religion" ideals of the west.
Praxis+Theodicy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 26, 2023 11:00 am
If Puritans are just a theocratic arm of the Reformed church, yes, they are having a comeback. Stephen Wolfe and Doug Wilson have written books explicitly arguing in favor of Christian Nationalism.
In what way is the Reformed Church experiencing a "comeback" as opposed to an accelerating decline?
Reformed church, not Reformed Church. The Reformed Church in America (RCA) is a declining mainline denomination, and is not young and restless like the theological movement to which this thread refers.
0 x
I grew up around Indiana, You grew up around Galilee; And if I ever really do grow up, I wanna grow up to be just like You -- Rich Mullins
I am a Christian and my name is Pilgram; I'm on a journey, but I'm not alone -- NewSong, slightly edited
MaxPC wrote: ↑Tue Jul 25, 2023 9:11 pm
Is there a possibility that there may be a revival of Puritanism that is underway?
It's hard to say what, exactly, that would mean. Who were the Puritans? They have a set of doctrinal beliefs that are basically identical to Reformed or Presbyterians. Their truly distinguishing characteristic was their desire to have a "pure" church, which is kind of a goal that needs further defining. The early anabaptists were accused (arguably, the accusation was justified) of wanting that same goal.
If Puritans are just a theocratic arm of the Reformed church, yes, they are having a comeback. Stephen Wolfe and Doug Wilson have written books explicitly arguing in favor of Christian Nationalism.
In what way is the Reformed Church experiencing a "comeback" as opposed to an accelerating decline?
Not the actual church, but the ideology of an authoritarian, "dominionist" ideology wrapped in Reformed theology. Puritanism is more an ideology than a church. So Puritanism can be making a comeback because the ideology is growing, even if the church(es) that give a home to the ideology are decreasing. In fact, now I'm wondering if the growth in the ideology is because of the churches' decline.
Praxis+Theodicy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 26, 2023 1:58 pm
Not the actual church, but the ideology of an authoritarian, "dominionist" ideology wrapped in Reformed theology. Puritanism is more an ideology than a church. So Puritanism can be making a comeback because the ideology is growing, even if the church(es) that give a home to the ideology are decreasing. In fact, now I'm wondering if the growth in the ideology is because of the churches' decline.
I wouldn't say it's "growing". People like R.J. Rushdoony and Gary North have been around for a long time. It remains a rather "niche" kind of thing that seems to continue to exist in that niche.
Overall, the Reformed denominations like the P.C.A. and whatever "denomination" Reformed Baptists as a whole are are trending in a more liberal direction. (There are now people inside the PCA who actually think they should be ordaining women, if you can imagine that.)
You can, however, head over to Puritan Boards (where yours truly is banned; I guess it was predestined since the foundations of the earth that I would not be one of the elect members of that forum) and find people who are busy advocating for things like restoring a Presbyterian state church.
The Quakers "fight" by absorbing punishment and abuse, like a Lamb. It really is the way of the cross to defeat evil. This suffering love way of fighting became known as, already in the Cromwell days, a "lamb's war."
They waged it in the New England colonies in the new world, absorbing all sorts of physical violence from the Puritans who wanted a "pure church." But they just kept coming. Eventually, that way of thinking won out. The Puritans developed a "half way convenant" and then also later came round to Roger Williams ideas. (Roger btw was a real Anabaptist. He was rebaptized by an Anabaptist that discipled him. This influence was behind is advocacy for freedom of religion in the colonies...and then specifically in Rhode Island. And later this self same idea, manifested in the nascent federal state. So one can make a cogent argument that Anabaptism is to thank for the current "Freedom of Religion" ideals of the west.
The Quakers "fight" by absorbing punishment and abuse, like a Lamb. It really is the way of the cross to defeat evil. This suffering love way of fighting became known as, already in the Cromwell days, a "lamb's war."
They waged it in the New England colonies in the new world, absorbing all sorts of physical violence from the Puritans who wanted a "pure church." But they just kept coming. Eventually, that way of thinking won out. The Puritans developed a "half way convenant" and then also later came round to Roger Williams ideas. (Roger btw was a real Anabaptist. He was rebaptized by an Anabaptist that discipled him. This influence was behind is advocacy for freedom of religion in the colonies...and then specifically in Rhode Island. And later this self same idea, manifested in the nascent federal state. So one can make a cogent argument that Anabaptism is to thank for the current "Freedom of Religion" ideals of the west.
Current culture warriors could learn from early Quakers about how to be faithful and effective.
Praxis+Theodicy wrote: ↑Wed Jul 26, 2023 1:58 pm...Not the actual church, but the ideology of an authoritarian, "dominionist" ideology wrapped in Reformed theology. Puritanism is more an ideology than a church. So Puritanism can be making a comeback because the ideology is growing, even if the church(es) that give a home to the ideology are decreasing. In fact, now I'm wondering if the growth in the ideology is because of the churches' decline.
The churches around me going this direction, to my knowledge, tend to be Charismatic not Reform. Perhaps there is a confluence of ideas that shrinks difference for larger goals and unites groups that would otherwise have been oppositional. Regardless it is a real event, it's happening and who knows where it is headed. Ideas like Theodicy that were fringe 10 years ago and now coming across the pulpit. There is a growing acceptance that secular rule and law must be dictated by the church.
