To discuss prayer postures and how meaningful they are to us in different settings. Some of this has been shared in another thread but perhaps more input may be interesting on why Anabaptists and others use varying postures in their praying.
I asked Valerie to share her data on 'lifting hands' in prayer. Everyone welcome to share their ways and why they chose that posture in that setting.
Prayer Postures
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Re: Prayer Postures
Our prayer postures are essentially cultural. A Catholic in Spain may have a different posture than that used by a Catholic in Norway, Britain or China. Charismatic Catholics lift their hands and sometimes sway. Others like us simply tuck our heads with our hands clasped in front.
"Pray as you can, not as you can't."
All prayer to God is a good effort.
"Pray as you can, not as you can't."
All prayer to God is a good effort.
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Max (Plain Catholic)
Mt 24:35
Proverbs 18:2 A fool does not delight in understanding but only in revealing his own mind.
1 Corinthians 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is folly with God
Mt 24:35
Proverbs 18:2 A fool does not delight in understanding but only in revealing his own mind.
1 Corinthians 3:19 For the wisdom of this world is folly with God
- JimFoxvog
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Re: Prayer Postures
I grew up with the Methodists. Eyes closed, head bowed, hands together was the tradition. I don't find that in the Bible, but it's familiar and comfortable sometimes.
I found a deeper relationship with the Lord with the charismatic movement. Hands raised, looking up seems more biblical, and helps me with an attitude of praise.
I've sometimes knelt in Methodist, Mennonite, and Catholic settings. It is good for feeling humble. Sometimes kneeling and hands raised to heaven feels a good posture for supplication.
My lay-led MC-USA church does not have much in the way of prayer posture traditions. A few of us from a charismatic background do raise our hands sometimes.
I found a deeper relationship with the Lord with the charismatic movement. Hands raised, looking up seems more biblical, and helps me with an attitude of praise.
I've sometimes knelt in Methodist, Mennonite, and Catholic settings. It is good for feeling humble. Sometimes kneeling and hands raised to heaven feels a good posture for supplication.
My lay-led MC-USA church does not have much in the way of prayer posture traditions. A few of us from a charismatic background do raise our hands sometimes.
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Re: Prayer Postures
Sudsy, I will post some of the quotes now- per your request-
2 Scriptures were quoted:
"Lift your hands toward Him (Lamentations 2:19)
"I desire therefore that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands." (1 Timothy 2:8)
Quotes from early Church:
"Full of holy designs, you....stretched forth your hands to God Almighty." Clement of Rome (c.96, W) He was a 1st century Bishop of the Church at Rome, says he well have been a companion of both Peter and Paul (Phil. 4:3)
"We also raise the head and lift the hands to heaven" Clement of Alexandria (c. 195) He was a learned Christian teacher at Alexandria, Egypt- who was in charge of the catechetical school there-lived between 150-215 A.D.
"We lived our eyes to heaven, with hands outstretched." Tertullian (c.195) Tertullian 160-230 was a fiery Christian writer in Carthage N. Africa, possibly an ordained presbyter-in around 211 he left the Church to join the Montanist congregation-
"With our hands thus stretched out and up to God, you tear us apart with your iron claws and hang us up on crosses... The very posture of a Christian praying is one of preparation for all punishment." Tertullian (c. 195)
"The Jews do not even dare to raise their hands to the Lord.... We, however, not only raise them, but even expand them. Taking our model from the Lord's passion, even in prayer we confess to Christ" Tertullian (c. 198)
"We commend our prayers to God better when we pray with modest and humility-with not even our hands too loftily elevated- but elevated temperately and becomingly." Tertullian (c. 1980
"We assuredly see the sign of a cross.... when a man adores God with a pure mind, with hands outstretched." Mark Minucius Felix (c. 200) He was a Roman lawyer who converted to Christianity (2nd or 3rd century) who wrote Christian apologetics-
"The tax collector did not pray with eyes lifted up boldly to heaven, nor with hands proudly raised." Cyprian (C. 250) Cyprian d. 258 was the Bishop of the Church in Carthage, N. Africa during a period of fierce persecution. Bercot writes "that an extensive collection of letters written by and to Cyprian still remains, along with various treatises written by him. These works give tremendous insight into the structure of the church in the middle of the third century"
I left out a couple, (practicing data entry is not a bad thing) but it does seem that the Apostles taught to actually lift the hands in prayer, and we see it was passed down as both oral and written tradition-
Bercot's book has a lot of quotes about kneeling, when to kneel, etc- as the Church practiced kneeling as well-
As mentioned earlier, the drawings of Christians lifting their hands does indicate the practice being done, having been taught to them apparently. It 'seems' by some of the quotes as reaching out to God or outstretched as those who follow Jesus who stretched out His hands in martyrdom-
2 Scriptures were quoted:
"Lift your hands toward Him (Lamentations 2:19)
"I desire therefore that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands." (1 Timothy 2:8)
Quotes from early Church:
"Full of holy designs, you....stretched forth your hands to God Almighty." Clement of Rome (c.96, W) He was a 1st century Bishop of the Church at Rome, says he well have been a companion of both Peter and Paul (Phil. 4:3)
"We also raise the head and lift the hands to heaven" Clement of Alexandria (c. 195) He was a learned Christian teacher at Alexandria, Egypt- who was in charge of the catechetical school there-lived between 150-215 A.D.
"We lived our eyes to heaven, with hands outstretched." Tertullian (c.195) Tertullian 160-230 was a fiery Christian writer in Carthage N. Africa, possibly an ordained presbyter-in around 211 he left the Church to join the Montanist congregation-
"With our hands thus stretched out and up to God, you tear us apart with your iron claws and hang us up on crosses... The very posture of a Christian praying is one of preparation for all punishment." Tertullian (c. 195)
"The Jews do not even dare to raise their hands to the Lord.... We, however, not only raise them, but even expand them. Taking our model from the Lord's passion, even in prayer we confess to Christ" Tertullian (c. 198)
"We commend our prayers to God better when we pray with modest and humility-with not even our hands too loftily elevated- but elevated temperately and becomingly." Tertullian (c. 1980
"We assuredly see the sign of a cross.... when a man adores God with a pure mind, with hands outstretched." Mark Minucius Felix (c. 200) He was a Roman lawyer who converted to Christianity (2nd or 3rd century) who wrote Christian apologetics-
"The tax collector did not pray with eyes lifted up boldly to heaven, nor with hands proudly raised." Cyprian (C. 250) Cyprian d. 258 was the Bishop of the Church in Carthage, N. Africa during a period of fierce persecution. Bercot writes "that an extensive collection of letters written by and to Cyprian still remains, along with various treatises written by him. These works give tremendous insight into the structure of the church in the middle of the third century"
I left out a couple, (practicing data entry is not a bad thing) but it does seem that the Apostles taught to actually lift the hands in prayer, and we see it was passed down as both oral and written tradition-
Bercot's book has a lot of quotes about kneeling, when to kneel, etc- as the Church practiced kneeling as well-
As mentioned earlier, the drawings of Christians lifting their hands does indicate the practice being done, having been taught to them apparently. It 'seems' by some of the quotes as reaching out to God or outstretched as those who follow Jesus who stretched out His hands in martyrdom-
Last edited by Valerie on Fri May 19, 2017 8:23 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Prayer Postures
I can relate to you in this- many think that in the Charismatic movement it is for 'show' but I didn't see it that way at all (even though one could I suppose be faking the worship) but I found it to be a very real way of worshipping the Lord, looking up as you say (Jesus looked up to pray) but also times of kneeling, humbling, really the posture seemed to be dependent on whether worshipping in adoration, or intercession, or crying out to God, or humble confession and seeking-JimFoxvog wrote:I grew up with the Methodists. Eyes closed, head bowed, hands together was the tradition. I don't find that in the Bible, but it's familiar and comfortable sometimes.
I found a deeper relationship with the Lord with the charismatic movement. Hands raised, looking up seems more biblical, and helps me with an attitude of praise.
I've sometimes knelt in Methodist, Mennonite, and Catholic settings. It is good for feeling humble. Sometimes kneeling and hands raised to heaven feels a good posture for supplication.
My lay-led MC-USA church does not have much in the way of prayer posture traditions. A few of us from a charismatic background do raise our hands sometimes.
I was never accustomed to 'rote' prayer or posture having been in this type of setting most of my Christian life-but while you are in prayer like this, it is between you and the Lord- period-
Where we are attending now does not practice most of this at all, kneeling, raising hands (there are a few) etc- but I realize that most churches being somewhat Sola Scriptura in trying to figure these things out are still attempting to be close to the Lord in however they understand that to be, in prayer-
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- Wayne in Maine
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Re: Prayer Postures
At the Bruderhof we simply dropped to our knees in front of our chairs and generally kept an erect position (like kneeling at attention) with head bowed. Some people prayed with hands lifted. A brother explained to me that we are kneeling before the Sovereign of the Universe, so we want to show deference and honor by our posture. I don't mind saying that it can be uncomfortable if prayers are long, but to this day I rarely, in a church setting where we kneel, lean my elbows on my seat or the pew in front of me.
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- Josh
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Re: Prayer Postures
In more conservative Amish-Mennonite and Mennonite settings, we turned around and knelt to pray.
In Holdeman and Apostolic Christian settings we kneel forward to pray.
As a church becomes less conservative (moderate to fundamental), nobody kneels anymore.
In Holdeman and Apostolic Christian settings we kneel forward to pray.
As a church becomes less conservative (moderate to fundamental), nobody kneels anymore.
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Re: Prayer Postures
I have noticed that it is dropped when two things happen - padded seats & carpet on the floor. Seems illogical, but I've seen it over and over. (Someone explained to me that wooden benches are 'cleaner' than padded cloth.... )Josh wrote:In more conservative Amish-Mennonite and Mennonite settings, we turned around and knelt to pray.
In Holdeman and Apostolic Christian settings we kneel forward to pray.
As a church becomes less conservative (moderate to fundamental), nobody kneels anymore.
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Congregation: Gospel Haven Mennonite Fellowship, Benton, Ohio (Holmes Co.) a split from Beachy-Amish Mennonite.
Personal heritage & general theological viewpoint: conservative Mennonite Brethren.
Personal heritage & general theological viewpoint: conservative Mennonite Brethren.
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Re: Prayer Postures
After I began attending AoG Wednesday evening services (still in the MB church house for Sunday services), on one occasion we were late getting there, and had to sit in the balcony. I was ashamed to realize how much the others seated around me had to do with how I worshiped. (But maybe I shouldn't have been? Does this just illustrate how the body works, and how easily we can "urge one another on to good works"?)Valerie wrote:I can relate to you in this- many think that in the Charismatic movement it is for 'show' but I didn't see it that way at all (even though one could I suppose be faking the worship) but I found it to be a very real way of worshipping the Lord, looking up as you say (Jesus looked up to pray) but also times of kneeling, humbling, really the posture seemed to be dependent on whether worshipping in adoration, or intercession, or crying out to God, or humble confession and seeking-JimFoxvog wrote:I grew up with the Methodists. Eyes closed, head bowed, hands together was the tradition. I don't find that in the Bible, but it's familiar and comfortable sometimes.
I found a deeper relationship with the Lord with the charismatic movement. Hands raised, looking up seems more biblical, and helps me with an attitude of praise.
I've sometimes knelt in Methodist, Mennonite, and Catholic settings. It is good for feeling humble. Sometimes kneeling and hands raised to heaven feels a good posture for supplication.
My lay-led MC-USA church does not have much in the way of prayer posture traditions. A few of us from a charismatic background do raise our hands sometimes.
I was never accustomed to 'rote' prayer or posture having been in this type of setting most of my Christian life-but while you are in prayer like this, it is between you and the Lord- period-
Where we are attending now does not practice most of this at all, kneeling, raising hands (there are a few) etc- but I realize that most churches being somewhat Sola Scriptura in trying to figure these things out are still attempting to be close to the Lord in however they understand that to be, in prayer-
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Congregation: Gospel Haven Mennonite Fellowship, Benton, Ohio (Holmes Co.) a split from Beachy-Amish Mennonite.
Personal heritage & general theological viewpoint: conservative Mennonite Brethren.
Personal heritage & general theological viewpoint: conservative Mennonite Brethren.
- ohio jones
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Re: Prayer Postures
If we adopted the Holdeman/Apostolic posture (which I consider preferable anyway) that would not be an issue.Neto wrote:(Someone explained to me that wooden benches are 'cleaner' than padded cloth.... )
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I grew up around Indiana, You grew up around Galilee; And if I ever really do grow up, I wanna grow up to be just like You -- Rich Mullins
I am a Christian and my name is Pilgram; I'm on a journey, but I'm not alone -- NewSong, slightly edited
I am a Christian and my name is Pilgram; I'm on a journey, but I'm not alone -- NewSong, slightly edited