Is there a relationship between eschatology and how one experiences society

[Josh]

Thanks, temp.

I no longer look to the world for progress, improvement, or hope, because the Bible teaches us that “this world is passing away, and also its lusts”.

Instead we are to build a heavenly kingdom and the kingdom of God is always growing and prospering and indeed doing battle with the kingdoms of this earth.

But, the artefacts of the world will wax worse: wars, rumours of wars, death, disease, pestilence, disasters, plagues, violence, wicked men doing wickedness. There is no hope at all to change any of this other than each person having a powerful, personal encounter with Jesus and experiencing born-again salvation. And without a personal relationship with Jesus, no one can find salvation but will instead be cast into outer darkness for eternal torment.

[temporal1]

Thanks, temp.

I no longer look to the world for progress, improvement, or hope, because the Bible teaches us that “this world is passing away, and also its lusts”.

Instead we are to build a heavenly kingdom and the kingdom of God is always growing and prospering and indeed doing battle with the kingdoms of this earth.

But, the artefacts of the world will wax worse: wars, rumours of wars, death, disease, pestilence, disasters, plagues, violence, wicked men doing wickedness. There is no hope at all to change any of this other than each person having a powerful, personal encounter with Jesus and experiencing born-again salvation. And without a personal relationship with Jesus, no one can find salvation but will instead be cast into outer darkness for eternal torment.

i have never been a young man. i know of the hell young men face. not all, but more than enough. each one who chooses Light is a miracle.

[Ernie]

The poll questions are limited to one line of text, so not much room for nuance...

Yes, I can't vote either. In some states I observed overreach. In other states, no overreach.

[barnhart]

The poll questions are limited to one line of text, so not much room for nuance...

Yes, I can't vote either. In some states I observed overreach. In other states, no overreach.

I suppose the poll would have to be reorganized to be meaningful.

[Nomad]

I grew up with a myriad of different systems. My understanding is that Pretrib rapture isn't a defining factor for dispensationalism. There are some who identify as Posttrib (Doug Moos), prewrath (Rosenthal), and probably mid trib who would also classify themselves as dispensationalist. I would probably be called Pretrib Progressive Dispensational in my view, although dispensationalism isnt exactly a hill I would die on.

I also don't really have issues with other perspectives but I can see how it affects our hermeneutics and how we view the Old Testament prophecies directed to the nation Israel.

Its interesting though, I was discussing this very thing once with a Charity brother and he was very gracious about different views of soteriology but when it came to Israel he came alive! He was quite upset with me and went on quite a rant about Darby, Jews, and how I had fallen into a false satanic doctrine called dispensationalism. It made feel a bit unsettled and I wasn't sure why he was so upset. But, maybe he had grown up around some outspoken dispensationalist who had reacted in a similar way toward him. Who knows...

[Josh]

One of the interesting things about modern eschatology is how recent it all is. Postmillenialism can at least be traced back to the Reformers circa 1600s, but chiliasm, millennialism, premillennialism, rapture eschatology, and dispensationalism are all solidly 1800s and later inventions and really did not take root until they found the fertile soil of individualistic American religion.

I also don't really have issues with other perspectives but I can see how it affects our hermeneutics and how we view the Old Testament prophecies directed to the nation Israel.

This is one of the more interesting aspects of 7-age dispensationalism and its descendants; many Christians become inordinately interested in whatever is going on in Israeli politics, as if the modern State of Israel is somehow the same thing Old Testament prophecy is talking about (which it isn't).

[Heirbyadoption]

This is one of the more interesting aspects of 7-age dispensationalism and its descendants; many Christians become inordinately interested in whatever is going on in Israeli politics, as if the modern State of Israel is somehow the same thing Old Testament prophecy is talking about (which it isn't).

In my experience (YMMV, to quote an older chap on here), many of those who get labeled dispensationalist don't always completely link the Israel referred to in prophecy with the modern geo-political state so much as they don't feel they are necessarily completely separate... Just a thought.

Nomad said: I grew up with a myriad of different systems. My understanding is that Pretrib rapture isn't [automatically} a defining factor for dispensationalism. There are some who identify as Posttrib (Doug Moos), prewrath (Rosenthal), and probably mid trib who would also classify themselves as dispensationalist.

Thank you for that distinction.

[Josh]

This is one of the more interesting aspects of 7-age dispensationalism and its descendants; many Christians become inordinately interested in whatever is going on in Israeli politics, as if the modern State of Israel is somehow the same thing Old Testament prophecy is talking about (which it isn't).

In my experience (YMMV, to quote an older chap on here), many of those who get labeled dispensationalist don't always completely link the Israel referred to in prophecy with the modern geo-political state so much as they don't feel they are necessarily completely separate... Just a thought.

Yes, it is a "many", not a "most". It is possible to be a reasonable premillennialist, although I believe the nature of it makes adherents more prone to speculating about "prophecy".

[ohio jones]

One of the interesting things about modern eschatology is how recent it all is. Postmillenialism can at least be traced back to the Reformers circa 1600s, but chiliasm, millennialism, premillennialism, rapture eschatology, and dispensationalism are all solidly 1800s and later inventions and really did not take root until they found the fertile soil of individualistic American religion.

Historic millennialism (aka chiliasm) is called "historic" because it was the view of some of the early church fathers.

[Josh]

One of the interesting things about modern eschatology is how recent it all is. Postmillenialism can at least be traced back to the Reformers circa 1600s, but chiliasm, millennialism, premillennialism, rapture eschatology, and dispensationalism are all solidly 1800s and later inventions and really did not take root until they found the fertile soil of individualistic American religion.

Historic millennialism (aka chiliasm) is called "historic" because it was the view of some of the early church fathers.

Perhaps with a very imminent millennium, but I cannot find any early church father who felt the literal 1,000 year reign would happen 2,000 years (or more) later. Thinking that is an entirely modern view.