NMB Trophy

[Chris]

Non Mennonite Background in moderate conservative and/or Beachy type groups - think Beachy, sort of apply that standard of conservatism across the other conferences (Pilgrim, etc.)

Are there "real trophy types"?

Do trophies exist? (both hard to explain)
True or False (example 1 and/or example 2)

Example 1
A Non Mennonite Background individual comes in sort of with a messy history or is a mess. Drug past, alcohol past, problem past etc. If they come in, the churches are happy to see them, even take them in as members. They may help the person with housing, job, etc. But this said person never really exactly a major influential or "real brother" or "real sister" in the community. More as a "victory" that somebody came. A trophy. Somebody to say "hi" too, greet, and even extend happy love to. However they aren't 100% "really in". More of a trophy of victory placed on the mantle...

Example2
A Non Mennonite Background family comes in convicted. Not a divorce and remarriage but a real marriage. Children are good and well behaved. Seemingly more acceptable but doesn't have a "menno" last name. No real sin issues, clean & sober, working etc. But without the last name this trophy is sort of in a "thin glass jar" on the mantle. While the family may be seen, enjoyed, and even let out of the jar sometimes, generally there would be more hesitation for -
1) Children to marry into the children of this family. (Not the right last name. While native Menno families appreciate the family, they would rather "their" child marry from "a good Mennonite family" (meaning native Mennonite family))
2) The man to be ordained.
3) The man to be fully trusted with church finances, contracts, and governmental functionaries of the corporate church.


Is either example true or false? Appreciate all thoughts, comments, and answers.
Sorry if this is subject is a bit raw.

[Soloist]

First one I think it’s situational, is the man living his life for Christ? Are they increasing in the knowledge of God?
There might be the “trophy” but the other aspects depend very much so on the character of that man and where he is in his walk.
I have known of people the Mennonites help but their lack of influence has more to do with the issues they are still working through.
The second one I have never seen an example of. I’ve known several non-Mennonite background people marry, one is even on the forum.
Some of these marriages are disasters, others work out well. I do think it’s easier for the woman.
As for ordained… there are so few of us that stay the course that there would naturally be less. The church I was going to in Oregon told me that an outsider would at least take 5 years before they could be ordained and I had asked as to born and raised having that limitation and was told they do not. This bothered me but I’m not ministry qualified so it was a mute point.
I don’t think my wife and I were trophies at my last church and we certainly are not at our new church.
I don’t know on the financial aspects, seemed like the same two or three people always got that and I honestly wouldn’t have wanted that responsibility.
New people (outsider or not) often get voted into speaking positions quickly in my experience much to my chagrin.

[Ken]

A third kind of "trophy" is trophy wives and trophy husbands. Especially ones acquired in overseas missions.

[Soloist]

A third kind of "trophy" is trophy wives and trophy husbands. Especially ones acquired in overseas missions.

I would never call them that nor have I seen them toted or promoted in anyway as a trophy. Would you rather the Mennonites were too good to marry them?

[Ken]

A third kind of "trophy" is trophy wives and trophy husbands. Especially ones acquired in overseas missions.

I would never call them that nor have I seen them toted or promoted in anyway as a trophy. Would you rather the Mennonites were too good to marry them?

Not at all. But my wife is foreign and others in my very large extended family have found spouses overseas. But there is very definitely a trophy treatment they get when meeting the extended family and church. That can also be kind of patronizing. She found it very off-putting. I saw the same thing more recently when the daughter of one of my cousins found a husband overseas while on a mission in Africa. He was far more educated and world-traveled than most of the family and from an affluent background. Educated in London, etc. But was treated a little bit like he had somehow been rescued from the heart of darkness and was lucky to be in rural PA. Kind of like a fresh air kid visiting from the Bronx.

[ken_sylvania]

First one I think it’s situational, is the man living his life for Christ? Are they increasing in the knowledge of God?
There might be the “trophy” but the other aspects depend very much so on the character of that man and where he is in his walk.
I have known of people the Mennonites help but their lack of influence has more to do with the issues they are still working through.
The second one I have never seen an example of. I’ve known several non-Mennonite background people marry, one is even on the forum.
Some of these marriages are disasters, others work out well. I do think it’s easier for the woman.
As for ordained… there are so few of us that stay the course that there would naturally be less. The church I was going to in Oregon told me that an outsider would at least take 5 years before they could be ordained and I had asked as to born and raised having that limitation and was told they do not. This bothered me but I’m not ministry qualified so it was a mute point.
I don’t think my wife and I were trophies at my last church and we certainly are not at our new church.
I don’t know on the financial aspects, seemed like the same two or three people always got that and I honestly wouldn’t have wanted that responsibility.
New people (outsider or not) often get voted into speaking positions quickly in my experience much to my chagrin.

Just clarifying - are you saying it was the 5-year period before consideration given to ordination? Care to explain why?

[RZehr]

That 5 year number seems like really a good policy. I’d extend it to any member. No one should be ordained if they’ve been at the church for fewer than 5 years, born a Mennonite or not.

[Soloist]

That 5 year number seems like really a good policy. I’d extend it to any member. No one should be ordained if they’ve been at the church for fewer than 5 years, born a Mennonite or not.

I was told the policy was three years for Mennonites. This was an unofficial policy of course. It was not a western fellowship policy.
This was what was told to me at my last church. An explanation was not given. Ultimately I only know of 1 or 2 seekers personally that have remained in a church longer than a handful of years. It seems like the ones I know have a bone to pick with the Mennonites too. I have heard of ordained seekers though.

[steve-in-kville]

I'm an ex-transplant, and I've heard the term trophy thrown around in PMC circles. How people like treated will vary from church to church. The brethren groups (basically anywhere on the spectrum) were more open to this than some mennonite circles. What was weird was the more conservative groups (PMC, EPMC, etc) were more open than KMF, but I can see why as KMF had more of a Horning-type mentality, at least the one's a rubbed shoulders with.

Clear as mud, I know.

[ken_sylvania]

That 5 year number seems like really a good policy. I’d extend it to any member. No one should be ordained if they’ve been at the church for fewer than 5 years, born a Mennonite or not.

I was told the policy was three years for Mennonites. This was an unofficial policy of course. It was not a western fellowship policy.
This was what was told to me at my last church. An explanation was not given. Ultimately I only know of 1 or 2 seekers personally that have remained in a church longer than a handful of years. It seems like the ones I know have a bone to pick with the Mennonites too. I have heard of ordained seekers though.

So it was the variation in how MB folks were treated compared with NMB, rather than the 5-year policy?
I can see how that wouldn't feel good for sure.