NMB Trophy

[Chris]

On a VERY serious note, is what I'm talking about with a NMB family that has its "act together", not leeches, not prominent, but just sort of "average....

Would their young adults of parent converts have a tougher time being married because they are from a NMB source? Let's say in a Beachy Amish / Pilgrim type of setting. I know there is a lot of variables. Would there be more scrutiny? What type of things would they face?

[Ken]

On a VERY serious note, is what I'm talking about with a NMB family that has its "act together", not leeches, not prominent, but just sort of "average....

Would their young adults of parent converts have a tougher time being married because they are from a NMB source? Let's say in a Beachy Amish / Pilgrim type of setting. I know there is a lot of variables. Would there be more scrutiny? What type of things would they face?

Of course there would be more scrutiny. I come from a liberal MCUSA background (well it was MC back then) and my NMB girlfriends or dates got more scrutiny than the ones with whom my mother could play the "Mennonite Game" I expect a lot of people here can tell the same basic story. I also don't think it is so much about marrying within a specific congregation, but marrying within the faith. In my Menno church growing up I don't think any young people got married to each other within the congregation, but many found spouses within the wider church at neighboring churches, through Menno colleges and schools, etc.

But I expect that even in conservative churches young people still pick their spouses and they don't do arranged marriages. So ultimately it is up to the couple involved and the same things that make someone a "catch" in non-Menno circles probably also apply in Menno circles. Those things are pretty universal.

[Soloist]

On a VERY serious note, is what I'm talking about with a NMB family that has its "act together", not leeches, not prominent, but just sort of "average....

Would their young adults of parent converts have a tougher time being married because they are from a NMB source? Let's say in a Beachy Amish / Pilgrim type of setting. I know there is a lot of variables. Would there be more scrutiny? What type of things would they face?

What answer are you looking for?

[Chris]

On a VERY serious note, is what I'm talking about with a NMB family that has its "act together", not leeches, not prominent, but just sort of "average....

Would their young adults of parent converts have a tougher time being married because they are from a NMB source? Let's say in a Beachy Amish / Pilgrim type of setting. I know there is a lot of variables. Would there be more scrutiny? What type of things would they face?

Of course there would be more scrutiny. I come from a liberal MCUSA background (well it was MC back then) and my NMB girlfriends or dates got more scrutiny than the ones with whom my mother could play the "Mennonite Game" I expect a lot of people here can tell the same basic story. I also don't think it is so much about marrying within a specific congregation, but marrying within the faith. In my Menno church growing up I don't think any young people got married to each other within the congregation, but many found spouses within the wider church at neighboring churches, through Menno colleges and schools, etc.

But I expect that even in conservative churches young people still pick their spouses and they don't do arranged marriages. So ultimately it is up to the couple involved and the same things that make someone a "catch" in non-Menno circles probably also apply in Menno circles. Those things are pretty universal.

Thank you for the response. This is a very important topic in my opinion. For non-menno families thinking of joining a Beachy / Bethel / Pilgrim type of church, the full picture of how they will be seen, scrutinized, etc.

Yes indeed its up to the young people of course, but parents can have influence in conservative circles (for or against). Such as if a young man approaches his father and he feels interest in a young lady. Could (typically?) the dad be more biased if the young lady is a child of NMB parents (both parents converts)? I know it's a vague question, I'm looking for a narrative or trend (in general).

[Josh]

On a VERY serious note, is what I'm talking about with a NMB family that has its "act together", not leeches, not prominent, but just sort of "average....

Would their young adults of parent converts have a tougher time being married because they are from a NMB source? Let's say in a Beachy Amish / Pilgrim type of setting. I know there is a lot of variables. Would there be more scrutiny? What type of things would they face?

In a healthy Beachy church, this isn’t too hard.

A few things to consider:

#1. Some people think they have their act together, but don’t.

#2. The NAV family needs to meet the same requirements as AB people. For example, they need to be members in good standing, be able to hold down a job and so on. It’s surprising how many people fail to understand this.

#3. AB guys and girls have heartbreak and get shot down all the time. Or an AB guy and girl like each other but their families don’t. An NAB family will experience the exact same thing.

#4. Some NMB families are very socially awkward and refuse to conform to the Anabaptist culture. I’m talking things like… weird conspiracy theories, males who don’t shower regularly and smell bad. And their parents will pick a girl they think they should marry. This does NOT work out.

#5. I would consider myself to have been one of the less “marriageable” NMBs yet I got married a few years ago. Likewise, my nephew got married last year. He face difficulty with his wife’s family - but all of them have left the conservative circles. His wife is the only left who is a member at a plain church. In the end the family has (mostly) blessed their union.

In Holdeman circles it is DEFINITELY easier for an outsider to get married, but in #5 above, that’s a really ethnic church and he married in… likewise when I was with the Beachys, one of their converts married the preacher’s daughter. I will be frank: it is really hard for young people to find a spouse and get married nowadays. I think it’s easier for an NMB person or family to find husbands and wives than it would be if they left Anabaptist circles and found ones in the world.

[ken_sylvania]

The NMB families I know who've joined ultra-conservative churches (oldest children in their teens), their background didn't seem to affect their children's eligibility as marriage partners. And perhaps steve will find this disappointing, but it doesn't seem like the Dad's business success or lack thereof was a significant factor either.

[Josh]

Another anecdote: amongst converts to Amish, even they seem to be able to find young men and women interested in marrying their children. In one particular case, the bigger problem was the family’s daughters found they weren’t interested in dating the (Amish background) young men who were interested in them!

[Josh]

The NMB families I know who've joined ultra-conservative churches (oldest children in their teens), their background didn't seem to affect their children's eligibility as marriage partners. And perhaps steve will find this disappointing, but it doesn't seem like the Dad's business success or lack thereof was a significant factor either.

I have observed the same. When I got married, the preachers did ask the deacons to review my finances, simply because they knew I claimed to have a good paying job, but my only visible possession was a 2000 Jetta. I think such a “review” is eminently reasonable.

[ken_sylvania]

On a VERY serious note, is what I'm talking about with a NMB family that has its "act together", not leeches, not prominent, but just sort of "average....

Would their young adults of parent converts have a tougher time being married because they are from a NMB source? Let's say in a Beachy Amish / Pilgrim type of setting. I know there is a lot of variables. Would there be more scrutiny? What type of things would they face?

In a healthy Beachy church, this isn’t too hard.

A few things to consider:

#1. Some people think they have their act together, but don’t.

#2. The NAV family needs to meet the same requirements as AB people. For example, they need to be members in good standing, be able to hold down a job and so on. It’s surprising how many people fail to understand this.

#3. AB guys and girls have heartbreak and get shot down all the time. Or an AB guy and girl like each other but their families don’t. An NAB family will experience the exact same thing.

#4. Some NMB families are very socially awkward and refuse to conform to the Anabaptist culture. I’m talking things like… weird conspiracy theories, males who don’t shower regularly and smell bad. And their parents will pick a girl they think they should marry. This does NOT work out.

#5. I would consider myself to have been one of the less “marriageable” NMBs yet I got married a few years ago. Likewise, my nephew got married last year. He face difficulty with his wife’s family - but all of them have left the conservative circles. His wife is the only left who is a member at a plain church. In the end the family has (mostly) blessed their union.

In Holdeman circles it is DEFINITELY easier for an outsider to get married, but in #5 above, that’s a really ethnic church and he married in… likewise when I was with the Beachys, one of their converts married the preacher’s daughter. I will be frank: it is really hard for young people to find a spouse and get married nowadays. I think it’s easier for an NMB person or family to find husbands and wives than it would be if they left Anabaptist circles and found ones in the world.

Agreed

[Josh]

An NMB family’s biggest problems they face with marriage will be:

#1. Your son or daughter marries into a highly ethnic family. This is like marring a fresh off the boat Filipino or Italian.

#2. Or, worse, they marry another NMB. Now the young couple has no idea how to fit into the Anabaptist culture. They may end up being just as “odd” as their parents.

#3. Worst of all, they marry someone in the world! (This is a problem AB families face too.)

Really, the bigger issue is marriages are for life. So the two families are tied together permanently, whether they want to be or not, down the road. Family life makes church, church leadership, and Christian living suddenly… a whole lot more important.