In the discussion, following the law of Moses and circumcision were considered at the same time:Adam wrote:I am always confused by the appeal to Acts 15. If we are to follow that literally, then we, as Gentiles, would only be required to "abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols, and from blood, and from what has been strangled, and from sexual immorality." Yet I don't know any Anabaptists (or any Christians at all for that matter) who believe that this is all that is required of them as Gentiles.
So I think their conclusion applies to both following the law of Moses and circumcision. And in Galatians, Paul says that anyone who is circumcised is obligated to keep the whole law of Moses - he thinks they go together too.But some believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees rose up and said, “It is necessary to circumcise them and to order them to keep the law of Moses.”
The apostles and the elders were gathered together to consider this matter.
Circumcision, like the Sabbath, predates Moses and the 10 Commandments, but circumcision and the law of Moses are considered together here.
But you raise many good points here. And Sabbath, unlike circumcision, goes back to creation.
The 10 Commandments are the basis of the entire Law of Moses. We did not have them before Moses. On the other hand, they are fairly universal things, most are part of the Noahide laws that Jews expected of all Gentiles:Adam wrote:Rather, Anabaptists, especially conservative Anabaptists, are very intent on following literally all of the commands of Jesus. But most of the teachings of Jesus are his authoritative interpretations of the proper application of the Law and the Prophets, which he came to fulfill and not to destroy. But if the Law and Prophets don't apply to us as Gentiles, then why do we bother following Jesus's teachings on these matters? Most Christians live in obedience to nine of the ten commandments, and it seems odd that we leave one out. I am not saying that we are wrong in leaving it out, but simply that it strikes me as odd.
And the instructions in Acts 15 rhyme quite a bit with the Noahide laws, assuming that no Christian group would allow murder or stealing or blaspheming God, and that the Christian church would be the governing body.Do not deny God.
Do not blaspheme God.
Do not murder.
Do not engage in illicit sexual relations.
Do not steal.
Do not eat from a live animal.
Establish courts/legal system to ensure obedience to said laws.
Exactly how we interpret "to fulfill and not to abolish" varies among denominations, groups, and interpreters, but I think the Bible clearly tells us that at least some things like circumcision and dietary laws are not binding on Gentile Christians.
True - but not the things that they were wrestling with. On the other hand, what they were wrestling with included more than just circumcision, including at least the dietary laws.Adam wrote:Never do we hear any of the apostles saying, "Why are you trying to love your neighbor? We are no longer under the law of Moses so we don't have to do that anymore." There are clearly parts of the Law of Moses beyond the things listed in Acts 15 that we Gentile Christians are expected to uphold.
I tend to agree - and the earlier the better - when they speak with one voice. On many topics, they really do not speak with one voice, but on this one they really do.Adam wrote:I do agree that the witness of the early church is clearly against Gentiles observing the Sabbath, and I am not arguing that we as Christians should necessarily observe the Sabbath (I don't). What I am saying is that the New Testament witness is not really clear on the matter. Jesus seems to support continued observation of the Sabbath (without all the man-made rules), but the early church seems to have abandoned the observation of the Sabbath. Perhaps the practice of not observing the Sabbath is more of an oral tradition that was not fully expounded upon in the New Testament. As for me, I place a great deal of trust in the practice of the early (Ante-Nicene) church as they continued the teachings of the apostles. So when they speak with one voice regarding an area that is not entirely clear in the New Testament, I am inclined to listen to that voice and follow.
But here's a thought. The Old Testament is all about explicit lists of what you do and what you don't do. Lists of religious practices, prescribed in great detail. Lists of exactly which holidays are to be celebrated and when. The New Testament really isn't. The change is not just that we have a different set of lists to follow now. And I don't think it's safe to simply replace Jewish oral tradition with a Christian oral tradition. The change is bigger than that.
For instance, when Paul learns that some Corinthians are going in to temple prostitutes, he doesn't respond by giving them a precise list of rules to observe for sexual behavior, accompanied by penalties for those who do not follow them. He reminds us who we are, and how we should behave as a consequence of that:
We belong to God, who paid a great price for us. Our bodies are temples of the Holy Spirit, and we cannot be a temple of the Holy Spirit and be joined to a prostitute at the same time. This is the kind of religious practice we see in the New Testament - knowing who we are in Christ, being set aside for God, and understanding the consequences of that.5 Do you not know that your bodies are members of Christ? Shall I then take the members of Christ and make them members of a prostitute? Never! 16 Or do you not know that he who is joined to a prostitute becomes one body with her? For, as it is written, “The two will become one flesh.” 17 But he who is joined to the Lord becomes one spirit with him. 18 Flee from sexual immorality. Every other sin a person commits is outside the body, but the sexually immoral person sins against his own body. 19 Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit within you, whom you have from God? You are not your own, 20 for you were bought with a price. So glorify God in your body.
As I read the Ante-Nicene fathers, I don't think they all did that exactly the same way. There was more variety in theology than I would have expected. There was more variety in practice than I would have expected. But they really do understand what it means to be set apart for God, and who we are in Christ.
I don't think any part of the New Testament clearly identifies specifically which parts of the Old Testament law are still binding on New Testament believers. I think both those who follow a 7th day Sabbath and those who do not can be equally set aside for God. That used to bother me a great deal. But increasingly, I think that God wanted to avoid giving us a book that can be used like Old Testament law was among Jews. The New Testament probably isn't the book any of us would have written if we were creating Christianity. But it's the book God wrote for us.Adam wrote:I just wish the New Testament were more clear in saying, "You don't have to observe the Sabbath anymore," just as it was made very clear that we are no longer to observe the dietary restrictions of the Law of Moses nor are we to continue offering animal sacrifices. I just don't see a real clear commandment to no longer observe the Sabbath and I find that confusing.