Ecclesial Evolution

General Christian Theology
Josh
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Re: Ecclesial Evolution

Postby Josh » Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:10 am

MaxPC, I'd love to hear you answer Bootstrap's inquiries.
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MaxPC
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Re: Ecclesial Evolution

Postby MaxPC » Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:18 am

Additionally: the College Thread has me considering the fact that many denominations and fellowships start educational institutions to equip disciples of Jesus with skill sets to be Christian leaven in society as well as evangelism. Perhaps this is one of those logical steps in spiritual/ecclesial evolution?
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Heirbyadoption
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Re: Ecclesial Evolution

Postby Heirbyadoption » Thu Jan 26, 2017 9:38 am

If Plain Catholics exist, let's have direct, open discussion about them, where we can find them, how they live out their lives, why they would choose, of all things, Mennonite-inspired clothing and what that means to them. Let's not pretend that there is a group of Catholics that are just like Plain Mennonites only Catholic, let's talk about what it means to be a Plain Catholic and how that relates to Anabaptism.

Max, I'd love to hear more on this too. I haven't personally encountered such Catholics thus far, nor heard of them elsewhere in any organized capacity. Perhaps you could expand on these things as Bootstrap has suggested? :up: A new thread might be in order.
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Josh
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Re: Ecclesial Evolution

Postby Josh » Thu Jan 26, 2017 11:07 am

MaxPC wrote:Additionally: the College Thread has me considering the fact that many denominations and fellowships start educational institutions to equip disciples of Jesus with skill sets to be Christian leaven in society as well as evangelism. Perhaps this is one of those logical steps in spiritual/ecclesial evolution?


EMU, Goshen, and Bluffton are certainly some kind of leaven.
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lesterb
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Re: Ecclesial Evolution

Postby lesterb » Thu Jan 26, 2017 11:45 am

MaxPC wrote:
lesterb wrote:One of the most easily noted shifts in Anabaptist history was the slide from ultra-evangelistic to the "shtille in dem land". By the time Anabaptists landed in North America, the push for evangelism had died and been replaced by the search for somewhere to raise their families in peace.

Do you think it was because of more religious liberty and less persecution in North America?

That was one reason for coming here. But the actual shift in thinking took place at least a few generations before that when the majority of the Anabaptists moved into the Bernese mountains, and similar places, hoping that out of sight would mean out of mind.
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lesterb
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Re: Ecclesial Evolution

Postby lesterb » Thu Jan 26, 2017 11:56 am

I'm trying to glance over these threads every day, but I don't have a lot of time to put together good contributions. Well, I'd maybe have the time, but I'm finding that I can handle only so much intense thinking in a day, and I'm trying to put those hours into Ecclesiastes right now.

But one area where I'm seeing some "evolution" in some of the fringes of conservative Anabaptism, is education. A century ago, the old Mennonite Church was moving into this. Goshen College was moving into accreditation and there was a cry for the need of teaching our youth from a more "Anabaptist" perspective, but giving them the necessary tools to survive academically alongside Princeton and Harvard graduates.

Now we are dipping our toes into the water again. Faith Builders started it, but Rosedale and some of the more advanced Bible schools like SMBI, also helped. Now you have Sattler University. I suppose I'll be dead before we know where these experiments will take the church. I'd really like to see them succeed but somehow Anabaptists and institutions of higher learning just haven't been able to coexist properly.

Maybe this belongs in the college thread, but I think it's a part of this one too.
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When a man's ways please the LORD, he makes even his enemies to be at peace with him. (Pro 16:7 ESV)

GaryK
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Re: Ecclesial Evolution

Postby GaryK » Thu Jan 26, 2017 12:01 pm

Bootstrap wrote:If Plain Catholics don't exist, let's stop pretending. The cost of avoiding this discussion or pretending, whichever it is, is really high for MN. We can always feel the tension of avoiding this discussion, and it never goes away. It keeps coming out in sarcasm or people who choose to pointedly shun other participants or a variety of other ways.

Your persistence in this matter is not helpful IMO. Have you considered the cost this may be having on MN? This is in no way a defense of Max.
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MaxPC
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Re: Ecclesial Evolution

Postby MaxPC » Thu Jan 26, 2017 12:52 pm

Heirbyadoption wrote:Max, I'd love to hear more on this too. I haven't personally encountered such Catholics thus far, nor heard of them elsewhere in any organized capacity.

I've sent you a PM, Heir. :D

lesterb wrote:
MaxPC wrote:
lesterb wrote:One of the most easily noted shifts in Anabaptist history was the slide from ultra-evangelistic to the "shtille in dem land". By the time Anabaptists landed in North America, the push for evangelism had died and been replaced by the search for somewhere to raise their families in peace.

Do you think it was because of more religious liberty and less persecution in North America?

That was one reason for coming here. But the actual shift in thinking took place at least a few generations before that when the majority of the Anabaptists moved into the Bernese mountains, and similar places, hoping that out of sight would mean out of mind.
It makes perfect sense. Constant harassment and persecution wearies. Thank you for the input on this and the college formation.
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Josh
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Re: Ecclesial Evolution

Postby Josh » Thu Jan 26, 2017 12:57 pm

Rosedale is certainly not moving in a "more Anabaptist" direction. I predict it will look like Malone University or a similar evangelical school in a few decades.
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Bootstrap
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Re: Ecclesial Evolution

Postby Bootstrap » Thu Jan 26, 2017 1:30 pm

GaryK wrote:
Bootstrap wrote:If Plain Catholics don't exist, let's stop pretending. The cost of avoiding this discussion or pretending, whichever it is, is really high for MN. We can always feel the tension of avoiding this discussion, and it never goes away. It keeps coming out in sarcasm or people who choose to pointedly shun other participants or a variety of other ways.

Your persistence in this matter is not helpful IMO. Have you considered the cost this may be having on MN? This is in no way a defense of Max.


Ignoring it doesn't seem to make it go away. Most other forms of Amish fiction are not protected as well on MN.

I don't know the low-cost alternative. The conflict doesn't seem to go away no matter what I do. I think that's because the issue doesn't go away even when we're ignoring it. This is where the Amish fiction is being written, and that's the basis of his participation here.
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