Prayers for the Catholic Church

[Soloist]

I've gotta side with Francis's view on this one. Surrogacy is really not a good thing, particularly the modern, industrial form of it.

It would be good to see other churches start to take a stance on this issue and also teach against it. Infertile couples often go through a lot of heartbreak, and fertility clinics are more than willing to make a buck - or 100,000 bucks - from these grieving couples.

Quite; so many children in need of adoption.

Wife: I have always thought it was messed up to spend so much money on fertility clinics and surrogacy when there are so many children already born that need families. I guess that’s something I agree with the pope on.

Someone we know was infertile for years, decided to adopt, ended up getting pregnant after that, adopted more and had 1 or 2 more children, and then found out that one of their adopted children’s moms were pregnant again and didn’t want the child, and ended up getting pregnant in the process of adopting so they almost have twins at this point. it is always interesting the stories of people who are infertile for so long and decide to adopt and then after they adopt, they end up randomly having a baby, but equally loving their birth children and their adopted children.

[MaxPC]

I've gotta side with Francis's view on this one. Surrogacy is really not a good thing, particularly the modern, industrial form of it.

It would be good to see other churches start to take a stance on this issue and also teach against it. Infertile couples often go through a lot of heartbreak, and fertility clinics are more than willing to make a buck - or 100,000 bucks - from these grieving couples.

Quite; so many children in need of adoption.

Wife: I have always thought it was messed up to spend so much money on fertility clinics and surrogacy when there are so many children already born that need families. I guess that’s something I agree with the pope on.

Someone we know was infertile for years, decided to adopt, ended up getting pregnant after that, adopted more and had 1 or 2 more children, and then found out that one of their adopted children’s moms were pregnant again and didn’t want the child, and ended up getting pregnant in the process of adopting so they almost have twins at this point. it is always interesting the stories of people who are infertile for so long and decide to adopt and then after they adopt, they end up randomly having a baby, but equally loving their birth children and their adopted children.

Indeed and amen. They have a blessed vocation and mission from God.

[eccentric_rambler]

Wife: I have always thought it was messed up to spend so much money on fertility clinics and surrogacy when there are so many children already born that need families. I guess that’s something I agree with the pope on.

Someone we know was infertile for years, decided to adopt, ended up getting pregnant after that, adopted more and had 1 or 2 more children, and then found out that one of their adopted children’s moms were pregnant again and didn’t want the child, and ended up getting pregnant in the process of adopting so they almost have twins at this point. it is always interesting the stories of people who are infertile for so long and decide to adopt and then after they adopt, they end up randomly having a baby, but equally loving their birth children and their adopted children.

I'm quite against surrogacy, invitro, etc. One of your conference members once told me that single sisters were suggesting they should be allowed to adopt abandoned invitro embryos. I'm guessing that never went anywhere.

I appreciate the sentiment that those unable to have children should adopt. I would point out, though, that there are far more than enough couples willing to adopt infants and toddlers. Statistics referencing high numbers of children available for adoption generally do not point out that most of these children are preteens or teenagers. We are still in the thick of having adopted older children. It takes a lot of grace, and I would suggest that many plain people are not cut out for the issues that go along with adopting older children.

I believe I am slightly acquainted with your friends and agree, from the little I have seen they are doing a wonderful job.

[Josh]

I would add that people who haven't raised children at all aren't really the best to be adopting older kids (I'm sure some can do it well, but it really helps to already be an experienced parent).

Couples in my church who want to adopt children have had to wait years to get a match. So e_r is correct: there are more parents willing to adopt than there are babies who need adopted.

[Soloist]

Wife: I have always thought it was messed up to spend so much money on fertility clinics and surrogacy when there are so many children already born that need families. I guess that’s something I agree with the pope on.

Someone we know was infertile for years, decided to adopt, ended up getting pregnant after that, adopted more and had 1 or 2 more children, and then found out that one of their adopted children’s moms were pregnant again and didn’t want the child, and ended up getting pregnant in the process of adopting so they almost have twins at this point. it is always interesting the stories of people who are infertile for so long and decide to adopt and then after they adopt, they end up randomly having a baby, but equally loving their birth children and their adopted children.

I'm quite against surrogacy, invitro, etc. One of your conference members once told me that single sisters were suggesting they should be allowed to adopt abandoned invitro embryos. I'm guessing that never went anywhere.

I appreciate the sentiment that those unable to have children should adopt. I would point out, though, that there are far more than enough couples willing to adopt infants and toddlers. Statistics referencing high numbers of children available for adoption generally do not point out that most of these children are preteens or teenagers. We are still in the thick of having adopted older children. It takes a lot of grace, and I would suggest that many plain people are not cut out for the issues that go along with adopting older children.

I believe I am slightly acquainted with your friends and agree, from the little I have seen they are doing a wonderful job.

Wife: Yes, you are probably right about how everyone wants a cute little baby/toddler and there are many older ones falling through the cracks. There are definitely benefits to having parenting experience before adopting older children, but somebody's got to do it, and many who already have children of their own don't do it because of influence to their children/too much other stuff on their hands, so maybe some childless people might need to do it because it's still better than them being raised in a broken system. Also, there's a huge difference raising a sheltered child from birth and adopting someone with problems, so maybe they could get better experience working with children/youth in the community.

[temporal1]

Wife: I have always thought it was messed up to spend so much money on fertility clinics and surrogacy when there are so many children already born that need families. I guess that’s something I agree with the pope on.

Someone we know was infertile for years, decided to adopt, ended up getting pregnant after that, adopted more and had 1 or 2 more children, and then found out that one of their adopted children’s moms were pregnant again and didn’t want the child,
and ended up getting pregnant in the process of adopting so they almost have twins at this point.

it is always interesting the stories of people who are infertile for so long and decide to adopt and then after they adopt,
they end up randomly having a baby, but equally loving their birth children and their adopted children.

These types of accounts used to be fairly common, and pretty amazing.
Old-time doctors would often advise couples distraught from no pregnancy, “R-e-l-a-x. Relax, don’t think about it, it will happen.”

These families’ adoption-pregnancy experiences would suggest the old doctors may have known something.

i remember hearing grownups talk about these things when i was very young, and not supposed to be paying attention.
That was before the world was obsessed with filling children in with every detail of adult life possible, and imaginable.

i was very interested in what was happening with unborns for as long as i can recall. the mystery of life.

- - - - - - -

wrt Pope Francis on surrogacy, his words reflect a person who has witnessed the atrocities of commercial rent-a-wombs, the exploitation of mothers and babies, i’ve no doubt it’s chilling. i’ve viewed a couple of short documentaries, i think one was in India, more recently, the above video in Ukraine. pregnant women are treated like cattle, their newborns are commodities.

all this lurks behind the cover of certain “ideal” accounts of personal sacrifice; evil knows how to market!

[temporal1]

As a Catholic, why is there so much posting about the RCC?
Does not make much sense to me.

Not a lot makes sense here. Why do we have three Catholics as members on an Anabaptist forum?

As far as “so much posting about the RCC” .. i believe you’re drawing conclusions from a small sample, taken over a short time.

at this moment, there are 213,261 total forum posts, searching “catholic” shows 2745 posts, which includes duplicates, quotes, and at least 2 definitions of catholic/Catholic.

some members were Catholic before leavng to become Anabaptist, 3 practicing Catholic members out of 6396, isn’t an overload -
particularly when the forum’s byline is: “Where Mennonites and others connect.” “others” is the operative word when these question arise.

my perception is, questions/complaints about POLITICS on this forum far outweigh questions of Catholicism.

as well, the early Mennonite leaders were devout Catholics who did NOT want to leave their Church, they had questions and wanted scriptural corrections/Truth (something we take for granted today) - this was seen as an existential threat in the day, it was banned, punished, even fatal.

in our times, it’s normal+healthy to compare+contrast, what was maintained, what was rejected? and, why.
it’s only in our ignorance that there is surprise when it is “discovered” that much has always been in common,
even tho there remains significant differences.

understandably, after violent trauma, the urge is to reject all!

intelligent, or informed, rejection is better than blind rejection (handed down without explanation).
i grew up in a stoic family where blind rejection was the way. my questions were not appreciated.
this is how history is lost. (i can say now.)

no matter topic on this forum, what i’m most interested in is the conservative Mennonite/Anabaptist response.
opinions, ideas, etc., it’s not like reading an encyclopedia. it’s real people. it’s how faith is lived out.

encyclopedias are great! then there’s real life. how are facts lived? how is faith lived?

^^my 2 cents

[temporal1]

^^If you’d arrived when i did, you might have wondered if MARRIAGE-DIVORCE-REMARRIAGE, or HEADCOVERINGS were all members were interested in. At other times, POLITICS have dominated “Active Topics.”

It’s great to step away from Active Topics, visit whatever forum categories interest you, and go for it.
Reviving old topics often produces interesting results.

For me, i prefer adding to or reviving existing topics, rather than starting a new thread everytime.

This forum has a lot of depth, it takes time to learn to appreciate it.
Dig around, you’ll likely find something of interest.

[ohio jones]

no matter topic on this forum, what i’m most interested in is the conservative Mennonite/Anabaptist response.

My unstatistically-researched impression is that you post more Catholic subject matter (at least recently) than any of the posters who are actually Catholic. You are likely to get more cM/A response, if that is indeed your interest, to subjects that are of greater importance to the cM/As amongst us.

[temporal1]

intelligent, or informed, rejection is better than blind rejection (handed down without explanation).
i grew up in a stoic family where blind rejection was the way. my questions were not appreciated.
this is how history is lost. (i can say now.)

you should have been there when i, probably 13 or near, asked my mother, “Are Catholics Christian?” .. “Do Catholics use the Bible?”
i never asked those questions again.

i don’t think this is uncommon.