Are court rulings moderating?

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temporal1
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Re: Are court rulings moderating?

Post by temporal1 »

Josh wrote:A big part of the vitriol against the Catholic Church is their decades of covering up abuse, and I can’t really blame the public for their reaction. I wouldn’t trust them either.

In Australia, multiple denominations including my own have also come up quite guilty of repeated, strategic cover-ups of abuse and perpetrators, according to the Royal Commission’s report. The national redress scheme is going to cost Anglicans, Catholics, and others millions of dollars to provide restitution to the victims. The denomination I grew up in, which is now a major global group of churches, also came up guilty with its head global pastor found complicit in coverups as well by the RC.

Meanwhile, various Catholic churches in Australia continue to insist on their “right” not to report abuse to the police:

http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-2 ... on/9889748
South Australia will legally oblige priests to report any confessions of child sex abuse from October.

In New South Wales, Catholic church leaders have said they were not willing to break the seal of confession to report child sex abuse, and would rather go to jail than abide by the law.
This is a very disturbing problem. i much prefer abusers be reported and brought to earthly justice.

The muddy waters are more-muddied, knowing there are powerful political groups/thugs who are exploiting these (horrible) wrongs in attempt to erase Christianity from existence.
They’ve had much success.

They are not seeking justice. They are out to totally destroy the whole.
Now what do the faithful do? Evil and evil.
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Josh
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Re: Are court rulings moderating?

Post by Josh »

temporal1 wrote:
Josh wrote:A big part of the vitriol against the Catholic Church is their decades of covering up abuse, and I can’t really blame the public for their reaction. I wouldn’t trust them either.

In Australia, multiple denominations including my own have also come up quite guilty of repeated, strategic cover-ups of abuse and perpetrators, according to the Royal Commission’s report. The national redress scheme is going to cost Anglicans, Catholics, and others millions of dollars to provide restitution to the victims. The denomination I grew up in, which is now a major global group of churches, also came up guilty with its head global pastor found complicit in coverups as well by the RC.

Meanwhile, various Catholic churches in Australia continue to insist on their “right” not to report abuse to the police:

http://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-2 ... on/9889748
South Australia will legally oblige priests to report any confessions of child sex abuse from October.

In New South Wales, Catholic church leaders have said they were not willing to break the seal of confession to report child sex abuse, and would rather go to jail than abide by the law.
This is a very disturbing problem. i much prefer abusers be reported and brought to earthly justice.

The muddy waters are more-muddied, knowing there are powerful political groups/thugs who are exploiting these (horrible) wrongs in attempt to erase Christianity from existence.
They’ve had much success.

They are not seeking justice. They are out to totally destroy the whole.
Now what do the faithful do? Evil and evil.
I’m not seeing evidence of that - much of the pressure has come from people who are Christians themselves.

These kind of accusations are troubling. I have called out and reported abuse when I saw it. One accusation against me was I wanted to “destroy the church”.

That’s completely wrong.
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temporal1
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Re: Are court rulings moderating?

Post by temporal1 »

Josh wrote: I’m not seeing evidence of that - much of the pressure has come from people who are Christians themselves.

These kind of accusations are troubling. I have called out and reported abuse when I saw it.
One accusation against me was I wanted to “destroy the church”.

That’s completely wrong.
i accept your viewpoint, but not as the only viewpoint.
(in my field of vision) the most recent evidence of groups/individuals hating on (esp the Catholic Church) were apparent just prior to Ireland’s May 25 vote on abortion. these folks do not tend to be duplicitous in their hate, they are proud. and, highly political.

one of the biggest complaints (my ordinary people) friends in Ireland had was regarding how FB and other social media was filtering-censoring conservative content -
btw, an allegation Mark Zuckerberg recently spoke to in the U.S. he did not deny it.
Catholic sites are filtered/censored, i have witnessed some of this in the prior 6 months.

i have occasionally been “unjustly accused” of different things in my life. it’s unpleasant.
that does not mean people should not have their opinions. there is no effective way to always prevent injustice. to think so, or attempt to control it, is human folly. we are all imperfect, life can be rough. so be it.

Jesus came to show us how to deal with it.
no one has it worse than He did.

sin hurts everyone. the ripple effect goes on+on.

i wish Mr Jim were actively posting.
he had some interesting things to say about the Catholic Church (that opened my eyes to a bigger picture than i’d seen before.) he is a man of few words. but, interesting words, they are. :D
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temporal1
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Re: Are court rulings moderating?

Post by temporal1 »

Several new “moderate” rulings lately.
:arrow: The WA florist;
:arrow: a travel ban case;
:arrow: CA prolife clinics cannot be forced to refer women to abortionists;
:arrow: unions cannot force payment of fees ..

Today, a resignation letter from Justice Anthony Kennedy to President Trump.
Not a ruling, but, another seat to be filled.
https://qz.com/1316183/supreme-court-ju ... ald-trump/

The letter:
https://qz.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/ ... =all&w=638
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temporal1
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Re: Are court rulings moderating?

Post by temporal1 »

Well, this turned out to be quite an event for the USSC.

Chicago Tribune: “Kavanaugh confirmed, quickly sworn in:
Conservative majority cemented on Supreme Court”
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nati ... story.html

Judges can be interesting people.
They do not always rule as predicted. Time will tell.

Politicians and the press behaved so badly. Words cannot describe.
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Re: Are court rulings moderating?

Post by ohio jones »

temporal1 wrote:Chicago Tribune: “Kavanaugh confirmed, quickly sworn in:
Conservative majority cemented on Supreme Court”
He came so close to being borked, though. Which would have actually been historically symmetrical.

Kavanaugh was nominated to replace retiring Justice Anthony Kennedy. Kennedy was Reagan's pick to replace retiring Justice Lewis Powell. But he was not Reagan's first pick for Powell's seat; that was Robert Bork, who got verbed for posterity.

Both Kavanaugh and Bork were on the DC Circuit Court of Appeals when they were nominated. Both were expected to shift the Supreme Court's balance of power to the right. Mostly because of that, both were examined microscopically and tried in the court of public opinion rather than just in the Senate.

In between Bork and Kennedy, Reagan nominated Douglas Ginsburg, but he was promptly weeded out due to his history of smoking pot.
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Re: Are court rulings moderating?

Post by JimFoxvog »

temporal1 wrote:Politicians and the press behaved so badly. Words cannot describe.
Yes, it's a tragic day for women when the US Senate says sexual abuse is no big deal. That's the message abused women got. Don't come forward about your attack. You will just be further victimized.
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temporal1
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Re: Are court rulings moderating?

Post by temporal1 »

JimFoxvog wrote:
temporal1 wrote:Politicians and the press behaved so badly. Words cannot describe.
Yes, it's a tragic day for women when the US Senate says sexual abuse is no big deal. That's the message abused women got. Don't come forward about your attack. You will just be further victimized.
you’ve definitely gotten the message “never trumpers” want you to get.

that’s not the message i’m taking away.

in 1978, i was ambushed+attacked from behind, dragged into an alley. somehow, i managed to escape.
later, my daughter, a freshman at a state university party, was brutally raped by a football player. she told no one, she did not tell me until after she graduated. she has never given me his name.

i guess our experiences do not count.

i watched a video of part of Ford’s testimony in which she stated she REMEMBERED she was not raped or physically injured.

she REMEMBERED she was worried because she was disobeying her mother by being where she was not supposed to be, with TEENS who were also being disobedient. they were all doing wrong.

from what i heard Ford say, her MEMORIES were sufficient to warrant dismissal of her case.

teens often disobey.
sometimes they get hurt in the process. this can be part of the maturing process, do not disobey your parents. teens can SCARE THEMSELVES in disobedience. Ford REMEMBERED she was scared of her mother’s anger.

none of this proves BK was present.
if he was present, and did as accused, these were PEER TEENS rough housing in a place where they were not supposed to be. no one was hurt. being frightened is a relative condition. to repeat, we can scare ourselves very easily, esp when we know we are doing wrong.

this case of alleged teen peers disobeying, rough housing, etc., cannot be compared with ADULTS IN POWER/AUTHORITY who chronically abuse their positions to exploit others .. there are too many examples to name.

bill clinton (thankfully, not back in the peoples’ White House) is one. priests who have abused are others.

but, again, these are not peer teens in isolated situations, no prior histories, no following histories.
there is no valid comparison.

were the teens wrong? yes.
Supreme Court level wrong - i do not see it.

if the elected-appointed are to be judged on their teen years, then, let’s look at all of them, unseal college records, esp of those who openly admit to being irresponsible as teens, and, judge-away.

teens are not typically judged in adult courts, their records are not made public, their records often are eliminated .. recall how Nik Cruz’s records were “protected” because of his age, he went on to murder.

teens are not scrutinized as adults.
frankly, i believe lib politicians have done more than others to ensure this.
now they want to reverse all that (not to defend girls-women) but to block someone they specifically oppose from a nomination?

it does not hold water for me, a victim of violence, a mother of a victim, a nervous grandmother of a female child - in a world that continues to be violent and abusive.

male or female, anyone can be a victim of violence. males may be more vulnerable than females.
males may be even less likely to report abuse.

there is lots to this.
but, today’s lib politics are really over the top in desperation. in my view.
YMMV :-|
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Re: Are court rulings moderating?

Post by Bootstrap »

If Kavanaugh had said this all happened when he was younger and he has matured, it would not have been much of an issue.

Was Kavanaugh lying under oath last week or telling the truth? That's much more important.

To me, Ford's testimony seemed credible, but the only hearing was a political hearing between two political parties with a direct feed to the court of public opinion. Most people I know made up their minds along political lines. I still have no idea what evidence tells us if Kavanaugh was lying about his drinking behavior and past sexual behavior or not. After we heard all that public testimony, why no public evidence about who was telling the truth? Wasn't there time for a more thorough investigation with public results? The public is being asked to trust Kavanaugh for life.

Another major issue is the nuclear option. There's a reason it's called that. If you use the nuclear option to confirm Supreme Court justices, it's no surprise that it goes nuclear. I would much prefer to have justices that 60% of the Senate can confirm, forcing them to come to agreement. I worry that both the Senate and the Supreme Court lost a lot of credibility last week. Nobody seems to think this was a credible process. Each side blames it on the other. Each side says the other was playing politics but their side was pure as snow.
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temporal1
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Re: Are court rulings moderating?

Post by temporal1 »

For lots of folks, the USSC has put itself in question for years prior to BK.
BK is a result, a response, not an initiator of biased/questionable rulings.

Ginsberg, Sotomayer, Kagan, come to mind.
https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/same- ... mpaign=LSN

In future, Amy Coney Barrett may be considered:
Image

The question for this thread began with,
“Are court rulings moderatng?”
At this point, the answer appears to be: Definitely.

Regarding BK, my view is, the noise is about “what he is certain to do.”
But, that is unknown, it’s (more) speculation presented as fact.


Time will tell. In my experience, judges often surprise/disappoint.
They are given leeway to rule, which often turns out unpredicted, and for the best.

Christians can pray for all impacted, now and in future. :)
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