Why Some Churches Practice Infant Baptism and others do not.

[Valerie]

Origen is not one of the apostles, and for this his writings are not part of the canon of scripture. Christianity is based on the teachings of Jesus and the apostles.

Are you part of a church that baptizes infants? If not, why not? Why do you expect most people on a Mennonite web forum not to push back strongly against the idea of infant baptism, a cardinal reason for the beginning of the Anabaptist movement? You seem shocked and disappointed by this. What else would you expect?

I am anything but shocked Mike. Scripture itself teaches there were oral teachings not written down. Infant baptism is evident in literally every country the Apostles took the Gospel and started Churches. Origen is not the only one who said it but he certainly didn't make that piece of history up.

I absolutely understand why the push back here. I live the A MN a Baptist people but they have their own extra Biblical dogmas.

No. We parked ourselves at Parkside when we were not sure where we "fit" with all this. They do not practice infant baptism NOR head covering & other Anabaptist practices. But we can't honestly try to join an Anabaptist church when we learned what we learned. They are, no offense, about the most stubborn people I've met but love them anyway

Which Parkside? I play board games every month at Parkside Green.

Chagrin Falls- board games? Interesting. I haven't visited Green. I do love Jonathan Holmes, have attended some of his classes

[Valerie]

I used to play Ultimate Frisbee with some Parkside Green people. Oddly enough, after they found out I had become born again and was attending a Mennonite church, they invited me to their church and Bible studies etc.

I guess before that, I was too much of a heathen to invite.

I highly doubt that Josh. Inviting others to church is strongly encouraged by Parkside. Must be some other reason.

[Valerie]

Russia and Ukraine’s war with each other is complete apostasy. And the Eastern Orthodox on both sides bless and condone troops going to war.

And J M is right - they changed a bunch of traditions. The Old Believers try to stick to the older ones. Which group is right? The EO hierarchy simply claims “We are the authorities so whatever we say is right.”

Again. This topic was about which churches have infant baptism. Not supposed to be about EO.

You are almost always the first one who bring up the ancient apostate church into topics such as this.

To speak about the authority of the ancient apostate church, is sort of like telling us what the Pharisees think about infant baptism.
True, Pharisees and infant baptism are two separate things. But we frankly don’t care what their opinion is, what their teaching is, beyond maybe casual interest. They just aren’t going to be viewed as any sort spiritual authority on anything. In fact as corrupt as they are, it is understandable to hold all of their distinctions with suspicion.

And to be clear, I find it easy to believe that your EO friends are against the war, and genuinely care about what God. They may love God more than myself, and may be better Christian’s than myself.
They are unfortunately part of an apostate church that is led by the blind. And we hope your friends get better eyesight themselves and cease to be led by these people.

I doubt that they will leave EO one of their ancestors was a signer of the Dordrecht Confession.
They are certainly more charitable at handling those outside their ancient faith. At least all the ones we've personally gotten to know and they're anything but blind which we've listened long to both Anabaptists and EO & hubby born into Catholic family- it's important to know and learn before being stubborn. Ive been criticized for covering my head for about 12 years at least when we go to EO churches I am joined by other women who cover even if not all do. Parkside- no way. A few former Menno ladies still wear their doilies all the years we've been going. The Amish now there, most dropped covering. Made me sad.

[ohio jones]

But we can't honestly try to join an Anabaptist church when we learned what we learned. They are, no offense, about the most stubborn people I've met but love them anyway

We prefer to think of it as "earnestly contending for the faith which was once for all delivered to the saints."

[Soloist]

I doubt that they will leave EO one of their ancestors was a signer of the Dordrecht Confession.

Is that supposed to matter?
There are very few Mennonites who actually follow what that says.

They are certainly more charitable at handling those outside their ancient faith. At least all the ones we've personally gotten to know and they're anything but blind which we've listened long to both Anabaptists and EO & hubby born into Catholic family-

I have found the few Catholic or orthodox that I’ve spoken to are only interested in talking to me if they think I’m a potential convert. Unfortunately, that’s pretty common for a lot of groups, including Anabaptists. I would say interactions with any of these groups depends on the individual you are talking to’s personality, and I’m sure that there are Catholics and orthodox who are open to conversation just like I am sure there are Amish and other Anabaptist groups that are.

At the end of the day, the two groups are in complete disagreement on what they consider to be core doctrines, and there can be no unity on them without one side compromising, so it should not come as a surprise that we would hold our line, just like we should not expect a Catholic or orthodox forum to suddenly say, “You know, you’re absolutely right on believers baptism.”

it's important to know and learn before being stubborn.

Show me a child who actually knows that and practices it… it’s hard to even find an adult who does.

The Mennonites and the orthodox are worlds apart in how they view ancient dusty documents.

Most Mennonites don’t learn history very well, and when Orthodox and Catholics come along with history of all this amazing ancient church, they don’t know the history of their own forefathers and why they rejected the heresy the Catholics and Orthodox preach.

Few of them are even familiar with their own affirmed confessions. I have actually had this conversation with several ministers,/ect and many of them don’t even know what they agreed to, although in my experience, few Catholic or orthodox outside of seekers actually know their history either.

[Josh]

I used to play Ultimate Frisbee with some Parkside Green people. Oddly enough, after they found out I had become born again and was attending a Mennonite church, they invited me to their church and Bible studies etc.

I guess before that, I was too much of a heathen to invite.

I highly doubt that Josh. Inviting others to church is strongly encouraged by Parkside. Must be some other reason.

Are you calling me a liar?

Before I was a Christian I invited them to our various Ultimate sort of parties (they didn’t attend). These tended to have a lot of alcohol involved.

It became very obvious due to dress issues etc when I became a Christian. After that point I also started talking about my new church. That was the point at which they invited me to check out their church.

[RZehr]

I doubt that they will leave EO one of their ancestors was a signer of the Dordrecht Confession.

I’m sorry to hear that they won’t leave.

They are certainly more charitable at handling those outside their ancient faith. At least all the ones we've personally gotten to know and they're anything but blind which we've listened long to both Anabaptists and EO & hubby born into Catholic family- it's important to know and learn before being stubborn.

These particular people you know may be more charitable, sure. The EO church isn’t the state church of America. So the EO doesn’t have any power or authority here. It’s much easier to restrain ones persecuty tendencies when it is illegal to do so.
They are known for the opposite of charity in their own countries, including persecution underground baptist groups - groups who then migrate to the good old USA for religious refuge.

Ive been criticized for covering my head for about 12 years at least when we go to EO churches I am joined by other women who cover even if not all do. Parkside- no way. A few former Menno ladies still wear their doilies all the years we've been going. The Amish now there, most dropped covering. Made me sad.

I wish people in non-covering churches would do this to the few women who choose to cover. It happens unfailingly. It does seem like the ancient apostate churches are more familiar and friendly to the practice.

These Amish didn’t choose Parkside because they wanted to keep wearing their coverings. And I’m guessing that everyone in their old Amish church, knew that they would drop the covering when they left.

[Josh]

I doubt that they will leave EO one of their ancestors was a signer of the Dordrecht Confession.
They are certainly more charitable at handling those outside their ancient faith. At least all the ones we've personally gotten to know and they're anything but blind which we've listened long to both Anabaptists and EO & hubby born into Catholic family- it's important to know and learn before being stubborn. Ive been criticized for covering my head for about 12 years at least when we go to EO churches I am joined by other women who cover even if not all do. Parkside- no way. A few former Menno ladies still wear their doilies all the years we've been going. The Amish now there, most dropped covering. Made me sad.

Why on earth do you stay at PS then?

[Valerie]

I used to play Ultimate Frisbee with some Parkside Green people. Oddly enough, after they found out I had become born again and was attending a Mennonite church, they invited me to their church and Bible studies etc.

I guess before that, I was too much of a heathen to invite.

I highly doubt that Josh. Inviting others to church is strongly encouraged by Parkside. Must be some other reason.

Are you calling me a liar?

Before I was a Christian I invited them to our various Ultimate sort of parties (they didn’t attend). These tended to have a lot of alcohol involved.

It became very obvious due to dress issues etc when I became a Christian. After that point I also started talking about my new church. That was the point at which they invited me to check out their church.

No. You assumed they wouldn't invite you to church as they thought you were a heathen. Did they tell you that? Parkside is huge on evangelizing so I just wonder if you assumed wrongly

[Josh]

I highly doubt that Josh. Inviting others to church is strongly encouraged by Parkside. Must be some other reason.

Are you calling me a liar?

Before I was a Christian I invited them to our various Ultimate sort of parties (they didn’t attend). These tended to have a lot of alcohol involved.

It became very obvious due to dress issues etc when I became a Christian. After that point I also started talking about my new church. That was the point at which they invited me to check out their church.

No. You assumed they wouldn't invite you to church as they thought you were a heathen. Did they tell you that? Parkside is huge on evangelizing so I just wonder if you assumed wrongly

Well, they had a chance to do so for several years, and they didn’t do so until after I started attending a conservative Mennonite church.

What inference would you make?