Occupations that are uniquely objectionable to Conservative Anabaptists

[ken_sylvania]

I'd like to primarily hear from conservative Anabaptists, but others can feel free to chime with thoughts and questions.

The discussion about working as a mail carrier, notably the comment about having to deliver morally objectional material, brought up this question in my mind. Are there any other similar occupations that are uniquely objectionable to conservative Anabaptists?

I do business with a conservative Anabaptist-owned company that is a wireless internet provider in our local area. Given what the internet is, would this be objectionable to some CAs similarly to delivering morally objectionable mail or packages?

I assume defense contracting would definitely be on this list, but how far is that taken? Would manufacturing bolts for a company that provides them to a defense contractor be the same? Would we manufacture custom furniture for an office in the Congress? What about providing goods and services to prisons?

Excellent topic, Mike. Another scenario: a Hutterite colony in Canada manufactures fire trucks. Fire fighting is a municipal job but it is one that serves to help. I wonder how that can be parsed?

I don't know any CAs who would find fire truck manufacturing to be objectionable. Those CAs that object to running with the fire company don't typically object to the work itself but the peripheral aspects. Some of our people served out their CO time as smoke jumpers.

[steve-in-kville]

Fire Dept - depending on the area, some fire departments rely on raffles, bingo, tractor pulls, etc for fund raising. Also some require life insurance for their members which most conservative Mennos find objectionable.

This is where I must disagree. I have no problem buying gun/raffle tickets full well knowing the funds are going to a volunteer fire company. If I win something, fine, but it is a rare occurrence. Fire, EMS and SAR teams in our area (for the most part) are not dripping with money like other areas.

I do not view this as gambling as I am not expecting anything in return. Sorry but not sorry.

[Neto]

Fire Dept - depending on the area, some fire departments rely on raffles, bingo, tractor pulls, etc for fund raising. Also some require life insurance for their members which most conservative Mennos find objectionable.

This is where I must disagree. I have no problem buying gun/raffle tickets full well knowing the funds are going to a volunteer fire company. If I win something, fine, but it is a rare occurrence. Fire, EMS and SAR teams in our area (for the most part) are not dripping with money like other areas.

I do not view this as gambling as I am not expecting anything in return. Sorry but not sorry.

Just a friendly question, as I have wondered about the propriety of participating in these things myself: If I (or you) really "expect nothing in return", that is, if there is absolutely no hope of actually receiving the prize, why not just make a donation instead, and refuse the ticket? If you win, would you claim the prize? (I DID participate in a raffle benefit for our youth's mission trip last year, and someone really did win. Some of the men in my SS class were calling it gambling.)

[Soloist]

Fire Dept - depending on the area, some fire departments rely on raffles, bingo, tractor pulls, etc for fund raising. Also some require life insurance for their members which most conservative Mennos find objectionable.

This is where I must disagree. I have no problem buying gun/raffle tickets full well knowing the funds are going to a volunteer fire company. If I win something, fine, but it is a rare occurrence. Fire, EMS and SAR teams in our area (for the most part) are not dripping with money like other areas.

I do not view this as gambling as I am not expecting anything in return. Sorry but not sorry.

Just a friendly question, as I have wondered about the propriety of participating in these things myself: If I (or you) really "expect nothing in return", that is, if there is absolutely no hope of actually receiving the prize, why not just make a donation instead, and refuse the ticket? If you win, would you claim the prize? (I DID participate in a raffle benefit for our youth's mission trip last year, and someone really did win. Some of the men in my SS class were calling it gambling.)

Generally speaking really depends on where you come now on the spectrum of conservative versus liberal as to whether or not it’s considered gambling.
I would lean on the gambling side. Although we don’t do raffles more from the notion that someone else doesn’t get the prize if we won. If you care about supporting the fire department, and don’t care if you win or lose… just donate your money or give the ticket away, no conflict then. I suspect though that you like winning even if it doesn’t matter to you. So that small chance is worth hanging onto your ticket in your eyes. Is that a fair assessment?
I would certainly like winning too, but we have avoided it.

[steve-in-kville]

Just a friendly question, as I have wondered about the propriety of participating in these things myself: If I (or you) really "expect nothing in return", that is, if there is absolutely no hope of actually receiving the prize, why not just make a donation instead, and refuse the ticket? If you win, would you claim the prize? (I DID participate in a raffle benefit for our youth's mission trip last year, and someone really did win. Some of the men in my SS class were calling it gambling.)

True story: last fall I bought a gun ticket from a coworker who volunteered with the fire company that covers my employer. Paid the $20 and moved on with my life. Some time later I got a text saying I won a shotgun. I'm not a shotgun person and another coworker offered to buy it from me. At the time we had an unexpected garage bill and I sold him the shotgun and we were able to cover the garage bill without making payment arrangements.

So I guess the Lord does work in mysterious ways

[Josh]

I personally think the program was wasteful but I can also see the forest for the trees and don't have any issues with businesses who took advantage of it legally. The US economy recovered faster than any other developed economy and that enormous injection of dollars was one of the contributing factors.

Conservative Anabaptists generally believe that legality is just one of many concerns before doing something. The fact they could legally get away with taking out a "loan" and then not repay it "legally" would be offensive and concerning to many of them.

The fact something is legal does not make it right.

[steve-in-kville]

Generally speaking really depends on where you come now on the spectrum of conservative versus liberal as to whether or not it’s considered gambling.

This would be true for a lot of things. For me, the energy expelled in making a big deal over some things would be better used in some other "heavier" issues.

[ken_sylvania]

Fire Dept - depending on the area, some fire departments rely on raffles, bingo, tractor pulls, etc for fund raising. Also some require life insurance for their members which most conservative Mennos find objectionable.

This is where I must disagree. I have no problem buying gun/raffle tickets full well knowing the funds are going to a volunteer fire company. If I win something, fine, but it is a rare occurrence. Fire, EMS and SAR teams in our area (for the most part) are not dripping with money like other areas.

I do not view this as gambling as I am not expecting anything in return. Sorry but not sorry.

I expect most of these things there will be people who disagree. But as Neto mentioned, I prefer to make a straight-up donation rather than buy a raffle ticket.

[Soloist]

This would be true for a lot of things. For me, the energy expelled in making a big deal over some things would be better used in some other "heavier" issues.

It doesn’t take me any energy to not do something

[ken_sylvania]

Fire Dept - depending on the area, some fire departments rely on raffles, bingo, tractor pulls, etc for fund raising. Also some require life insurance for their members which most conservative Mennos find objectionable.

This is where I must disagree. I have no problem buying gun/raffle tickets full well knowing the funds are going to a volunteer fire company. If I win something, fine, but it is a rare occurrence. Fire, EMS and SAR teams in our area (for the most part) are not dripping with money like other areas.

I do not view this as gambling as I am not expecting anything in return. Sorry but not sorry.

Just a friendly question, as I have wondered about the propriety of participating in these things myself: If I (or you) really "expect nothing in return", that is, if there is absolutely no hope of actually receiving the prize, why not just make a donation instead, and refuse the ticket? If you win, would you claim the prize? (I DID participate in a raffle benefit for our youth's mission trip last year, and someone really did win. Some of the men in my SS class were calling it gambling.)

I was at a dinner once where there were tickets at each seat for a door prize giveaway. My ticket was one of the winning tickets so I gave it to another fellow at my table and he collected the prize.