Hindus, Muslims, and Christians

[Ken]

I really doubt any teacher contracts state “You may not practice the core fundamentals of the Christian faith.”

The law says if you are a teacher you cannon proselytize in your classroom. The Supreme Court made this explicit in the 1962 case Engel v. Vitale.

And yes, every public school district in the country is going to expect you to follow the law. Not just this law but all the other laws that apply to your profession and duties such as special education law, disability law, laws against sexual harassment of students, and non-discrimination laws.

At that point you’re going to be arguing about what is proselytizing or not. It’s ambiguous and really you need to see how it’s locally enforced. The times I have objected to signing had much more specific contracts. Something that ambiguous is not really a problem.
Virtually every contract has something about unwanted witnessing.

The US Department of Education has published very specific guidelines on this subject including various examples. Every teacher who is tempted to cross the line should know exactly where that line is. https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/rel ... dance.html

And yes, different districts and different administrators will enforce things differently. But the actual law and guidelines are the same across the country.

[Soloist]

The US Department of Education has published very specific guidelines on this subject including various examples. Every teacher who is tempted to cross the line should know exactly where that line is. https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/rel ... dance.html

And yes, different districts and different administrators will enforce things differently. But the actual law and guidelines are the same across the country.

There is reality and then there is the text book.

[RZehr]

The US Department of Education has published very specific guidelines on this subject including various examples. Every teacher who is tempted to cross the line should know exactly where that line is. https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/rel ... dance.html

And yes, different districts and different administrators will enforce things differently. But the actual law and guidelines are the same across the country.

There is reality and then there is the text book.

Right. A real quick scat a a couple section on the end, show some explicit examples of right of the student to religious expression, that I bet get violated by liberal teachers from time to time without repercussions.

[Ken]

The US Department of Education has published very specific guidelines on this subject including various examples. Every teacher who is tempted to cross the line should know exactly where that line is. https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/rel ... dance.html

And yes, different districts and different administrators will enforce things differently. But the actual law and guidelines are the same across the country.

There is reality and then there is the text book.

Nevertheless, the actual law is what you are expected to follow when you are a teacher. Whether it is proselytizing in the classroom, following the IEP of a special education student, following the 504 plan of a disabled student, maintaining confidentially of student records, or having sexual relations with one of your students.

[Soloist]

Nevertheless, the actual law is what you are expected to follow when you are a teacher. Whether it is proselytizing in the classroom, following the IEP of a special education student, following the 504 plan of a disabled student, maintaining confidentially of student records, or having sexual relations with one of your students.

Do you drive the speed limit Ken?

[ken_sylvania]

The US Department of Education has published very specific guidelines on this subject including various examples. Every teacher who is tempted to cross the line should know exactly where that line is. https://www2.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/rel ... dance.html

And yes, different districts and different administrators will enforce things differently. But the actual law and guidelines are the same across the country.

There is reality and then there is the text book.

Nevertheless, the actual law is what you are expected to follow when you are a teacher. Whether it is proselytizing in the classroom, following the IEP of a special education student, following the 504 plan of a disabled student, maintaining confidentially of student records, or having sexual relations with one of your students.

If that's all part of the actual law a teacher is expected to follow then the system is more broken than I expected.

[Josh]

I really doubt any teacher contracts state “You may not practice the core fundamentals of the Christian faith.”

The law says if you are a teacher you cannot proselytize in your classroom. The Supreme Court made this explicit in the 1962 case Engel v. Vitale.

And yes, every public school district in the country is going to expect you to follow the law. Not just this law but all the other laws that apply to your profession such as special education law, disability law, laws against sexual harassment of students, and non-discrimination laws. Which is why all of those topics are covered in every teacher certification program in the country.

God’s word is higher than any of men’s laws.

[Ken]

There is reality and then there is the text book.

Nevertheless, the actual law is what you are expected to follow when you are a teacher. Whether it is proselytizing in the classroom, following the IEP of a special education student, following the 504 plan of a disabled student, maintaining confidentially of student records, or having sexual relations with one of your students.

If that's all part of the actual law a teacher is expected to follow then the system is more broken than I expected.

Those are just some random examples of education law that applies to the teaching profession. Not a complete summary of the full scope of policies and laws that a teacher is expected to follow. Education law is a semester-long course in most teacher training programs. They are very serious about it.

[Soloist]

I am going to assume based off of your non-answer that you understand the point I was making and don’t actually have a sound argument against it.

[Ken]

I am going to assume based off of your non-answer that you understand the point I was making and don’t actually have a sound argument against it.

The law is actually pretty clear and explicit.

The Constitution does not, however, prohibit school employees themselves from engaging in private prayer during the workday where they are not acting in their official capacities and where their prayer does not result in any coercion of students. Before school or during breaks, for instance, teachers may meet with other teachers for prayer or religious study to the same extent that they may engage in other conversation or nonreligious activities. School employees may also engage in private religious expression or brief personal religious observance during such times, subject to the same neutral rules the school applies to other private conduct by its employees. Employees engaging in such expression or observance may not, however, compel, coerce, persuade, or encourage students to join in the employee's prayer or other religious activity, and a school may take reasonable measures to ensure that students are not pressured or encouraged to join in the private prayer of their teachers or coaches.

and

Public schools may not provide religious instruction, but they may teach about religion and promote religious liberty and respect for the religious views (or lack thereof) of all. For example, philosophical questions concerning religion, the history of religion, comparative religion, religious texts as literature, and the role of religion in the history of the United States and other countries are all permissible public school subjects. Similarly, it is permissible to study religious influences on philosophy, art, music, literature, and social studies. For example, public schools generally may allow student choirs to perform music inspired by or based on religious themes or texts as part of school-sponsored activities and events, provided that the music is not performed as a religious exercise and is not used to promote or favor religion generally, a particular religion, or a religious belief.

Although public schools may teach about religious holidays, including their religious aspects, and may celebrate the secular aspects of holidays, schools may not observe holidays as religious events, nor may schools promote or disparage such observance by students.

How does this work in practice? Teachers actually spend most of their day out of sight of administrators or other teachers. You are in your classroom alone with your teachers unless you are in some sort of team teaching situation. So is there a highway cop standing around to step in? Of course not.

What would actually happen and what would be the consequences if you chose to violate these standards? Maybe nothing. Or maybe a student will tell their parents or complain to another teacher or counselor about your behavior. In this day and age, maybe a student will record you on their cell phone and post it online and you get to be the teacher who goes viral on twitter proselyting in a public school classroom.

Either way you will be forcing your district to address the situation and you will end up in some sort of disciplinary hearing. And your administrators and maybe some district administrator will decide what to do. At a minimum you'd be warned to stop. If they want to get rid of you anyway for any reason, you just gave them the excuse to fire you. If you don't stop and it becomes a repeat problem any parent might file a complaint with the State Board of Education and they might open an investigation and decide to suspend your teaching license which doesn't just mean you are fired, it means you can't work anywhere in the state and possibly not in any other state either, since they share information on teachers who have had their licenses stripped. And a standard question on any teacher employment application is whether you have been subject to any disciplinary proceedings or had your license stripped in any state.

So yes, it is a little bit like speeding. Maybe you'll get away with it, maybe for a long time. But maybe not. And in any event, you are still violating our professional duties and knowingly violating the contract that you signed. That does mean something to most people.