Christians and Trans

Christian ethics and theology with an Anabaptist perspective
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Bootstrap
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Christians and Trans

Post by Bootstrap »

This thread is for discussing how we, as Christians who believe in creation as male and female, should relate to trans issues in the surrounding culture. Please do not debate whether the Bible teaches that - start a new thread if you want to do that. Please do not attack people, neither MN participants nor others. This thread is for us to explore how we respond.

I think the Bible is very clear that we were created as male and female. Today, many people in our surrounding culture no longer believe that your physical body knows whether you are male or female, we see definitions like this:
Sex and gender

In the English language, the terms sex and gender are often used interchangeably in the vernacular. However, in a medical and technically scientific sense, these words are not synonymous. Increasingly, the term gender is being accepted to define psychophysiologic processes involved in identity and social role. Therefore, it is not uncommon to hear references to "gender" by professionals from numerous disciplines, including medicine, psychology, anthropology, and social science. Gender comes from the Latin word genus, meaning kind or race. It is defined by one's own identification as male, female, or other; gender may also be based on legal status, social interactions, public persona, personal experiences, and psychologic setting.

Sex, from the Latin word sexus, is defined by the gonads, or potential gonads, either phenotypically or genotypically. It is generally assigned at birth based on external genital appearance due to the common assumption that this represents chromosomal or internal anatomic status. When a newborn presents with ambiguous genitalia, the sex of rearing is determined by the multidisciplinary team in partnership with the family, depending on multiple factors, with the understanding that the child will define their own gender identity over time, which may or may not be congruent with the sex of rearing.
That strikes me as deeply wrong. I think our bodies know if we are male or female, and I think that is rooted in God's creation. But just calling it "evil" or saying nasty things about the people who believe this doesn't seem to convince anyone.

How should we, as Christians, approach this?
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Soloist
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Re: Christians and Trans

Post by Soloist »

Bootstrap wrote: Mon Apr 01, 2024 1:32 pm
That strikes me as deeply wrong. I think our bodies know if we are male or female, and I think that is rooted in God's creation. But just calling it "evil" or saying nasty things about the people who believe this doesn't seem to convince anyone.

How should we, as Christians, approach this?

With compassion and the same as homosexuality or divorce and remarriage.
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steve-in-kville
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Re: Christians and Trans

Post by steve-in-kville »

Soloist wrote: Mon Apr 01, 2024 1:42 pm
With compassion and the same as homosexuality or divorce and remarriage.
This my current state of mid. I've had a variety of coworkers that are/were gay or lesbian, but no trans as of this point. Keep it professional, and we'll be fine in the workplace.
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temporal1
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Re: Christians and Trans

Post by temporal1 »

Soloist wrote: Mon Apr 01, 2024 1:42 pm
Bootstrap wrote: Mon Apr 01, 2024 1:32 pm That strikes me as deeply wrong. I think our bodies know if we are male or female, and I think that is rooted in God's creation. But just calling it "evil" or saying nasty things about the people who believe this doesn't seem to convince anyone.

How should we, as Christians, approach this?
With compassion and the same as homosexuality or divorce and remarriage.
And, with special care+protection toward minors, dependents, the vulnerable: (“wait” is not a dirty word.)
fornication is a sin, other carnal indulgences are not specially exempt.

in the example of traditional marriage, “forsaking all others” does not exempt ss others.

for some inexplicable+indefensible reason, the current trend is focus on minors. this needs to be ended.
no sign it’s about to go away on its own.

Gender confusion
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Last edited by temporal1 on Mon Apr 01, 2024 2:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Soloist
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Re: Christians and Trans

Post by Soloist »

steve-in-kville wrote: Mon Apr 01, 2024 1:49 pm This my current state of mid. I've had a variety of coworkers that are/were gay or lesbian, but no trans as of this point. Keep it professional, and we'll be fine in the workplace.
I’ve had complaints filed against me for questions trans supportive people have asked. Professional would be to refuse to answer questions but I don’t believe that asking questions about what I believe is something I should refuse to answer.w

temporal1 wrote: Mon Apr 01, 2024 1:53 pm And, with special care+protection toward minors, dependents, the vulnerable: (“wait” is not a dirty word.)
fornication is a sin, other carnal indulgences are not specially exempt.
Wait or not wait and protection is tied fairly strongly to political opinions. If someone asks me my opinion, I’ll tell them but I’m not going to campaign on it.

for some inexplicable+indefensible reason, the current trend is focus on minors. this needs to be ended.
no sign it’s about to go away on its own.
It’s very understandable if you believe that “passing” is the pinnacle of success. Earlier you take hormones, the bigger the results.
Passing equates to their understanding of safety and equality.
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Re: Christians and Trans

Post by Soloist »

A bigger issue starting to slip in just like how divorce and remarriage did and homosexuality did is that transgender is in some circles starting to be acceptable if you act appropriately for your new gender. Aka ftm is expected to be the breadwinner and mtf is expected to fulfill the wife’s role. This is in some ways mind boggling that it’s entering the church but it’s very obvious that the broader church sways with the world.
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Re: Christians and Trans

Post by temporal1 »

Soloist wrote: Mon Apr 01, 2024 1:59 pm
temporal1 wrote: Mon Apr 01, 2024 1:53 pm And, with special care+protection toward minors, dependents, the vulnerable: (“wait” is not a dirty word.)
fornication is a sin, other carnal indulgences are not specially exempt.
Wait or not wait and protection is tied fairly strongly to political opinions. If someone asks me my opinion, I’ll tell them but I’m not going to campaign on it.
i’m not following.
i don’t see politics involved. just recalling how, in my childhood+teen years, abstaining was widely valued.
i remember being puzzled by it, not understanding what “it” was, growing into feelings i didn’t understand, there was a lot of mystery .. which i don’t see as negative. “waiting” was an important concept - not for sex, alone, but for MANY privileges that are earned with time, effort, investment. all these experiences contribute to a maturing human experience. TIME.

humans aren’t reptiles, ready to go out of the shell.

humans are specially slow to mature, yet the end result is a higher intellect (God’s design).

it’s beyond me why so many want to steal childhood development from children. what’s the point?

natural human development should not be political. it should be universally respected and protected.
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Re: Christians and Trans

Post by Soloist »

temporal1 wrote: Mon Apr 01, 2024 2:14 pmi’m not following.
i don’t see politics involved. just recalling how, in my childhood+teen years, abstaining was widely valued.
i remember being puzzled by it, not understanding what “it” was, growing into feelings i didn’t understand, there was a lot of mystery .. which i don’t see as negative. “waiting” was an important concept - not for sex, alone, but for MANY privileges that are earned with time, effort, investment. all these experiences contribute to a maturing human experience. TIME.

humans aren’t reptiles, ready to go out of the shell.

humans are specially slow to mature, yet the end result is a higher intellect (God’s design).

it’s beyond me why so many want to steal childhood development from children. what’s the point?

natural human development should not be political. it should be universally respected and protected.
What is the liberal going to say? They are going to say its a child’s right to have their correct gendered childhood.
Obviously I disagree with the liberals on this position but to say it’s not political is political.
But what I’m getting at is our actions, I don’t vote I don’t go to rallies, but if I asked I speak my mind.

Someone who believes that they should be the opposite gender would say that laws preventing them from transitioning is stealing their childhood.
On the other side you stated the opinion quite clearly. These are two political positions, they shouldn’t be, but they are.
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Josh
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Re: Christians and Trans

Post by Josh »

One of the first things as Christians we should do is tune out of the political “culture wars”, which means turning off the TV and closing your web browser.
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NedFlanders
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Re: Christians and Trans

Post by NedFlanders »

Trans people are mentally ill. Mentally ill people are much more delicate and prone to things like suicide. I think they are to be handled with a soft type of compassion. They, much like gay and lesbian people identify as their sin rather recognizing the choice they have so any attempt to be straight forward with them about reality is taking so personally they cannot handle it the same as a sane person. I thinking coming back to talk about my personal choices without pointing the finger at them may be the best example to get them to start to reconsider. Also with much prayer and fasting!
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