Seekers and troubled homes

[GoodGirl]

I’m just thinking outloud here, so maybe ignore me, but if a wife says there is abuse, and a husband explains it away… sure he might be right… *but* that’s a huge risk to take.

My dad used to say, ‘Shoot first, ask questions later.’

My gut says,’guarantee the wife & children are safe, and ask questions later.’

It’s too risky otherwise.

[Verity]

Josh, GoodGirl, thank you both of you for sharing your hearts. What I am hearing is that our burdens are very very close.

May I rephrase what you said, GoodGirl and Josh?
#1 priority is to protect the vulnerable
#2 be open to hearing/seeing the whole story even if it gets ugly
#3 have courage to act even when it costs dearly

[In the story you shared, Josh, the man was the vulnerable one as a foreigner and outsider]

GoodGirl, I stand with you in person, but I can and will fight on my knees tonight. The battle is the Lord's.

[Josh]

I’m just thinking outloud here, so maybe ignore me, but if a wife says there is abuse, and a husband explains it away… sure he might be right… *but* that’s a huge risk to take.

My dad used to say, ‘Shoot first, ask questions later.’

[/quote]

As Anabaptists let’s not shoot anyone at all.

My gut says,’guarantee the wife & children are safe, and ask questions later.’

We should want to make sure husband, wife, & children are all safe.

It’s too risky otherwise.

Ok, I might start crying, so time to step away.

Carry on.

The simple fact is both men and women can be abusers. Nobody should be believed, or not believed, merely because they are a man or a woman.

Consider how you would want your own son or daughter treated - including one who ends up married to a very evil woman or man.

[GoodGirl]

For the record, my dad is not & does not claim to be, a Christian in any way, shape, or form. But it is an expression he used for some instances.

[GoodGirl]

Josh, I just realized you might have really personal thoughts on this due to your first marriage. That’s totally okay & I get it. I have a brother with a ‘crazy ex-wife.’

But I don’t know… I wouldn’t go thru all the trouble of becoming anabaptist if I was just going to turn around & lie about my husband. That’s me though.

I seriously get you probably had a completely different experience, and your first wife might have totally been in the wrong.

I hope we can meet in the middle.

I do just think, on some level, women *are* the weaker vessel (at least generally) & if they are asking for help, there’s a good chance things got pretty bad to make them brave enough to reach out.

Especially (???) in anabaptist churches where, generally speaking, men have the upper hand.

[GoodGirl]

I am just speaking from the heart, please don’t rip me apart.

I’ve been through a lot, but I recognize that Josh~ you probably have too. I’m sorry.

[GoodGirl]

My brother went thru the wringer in a ‘he said/she said’ divorce, so I am not saying it doesn’t happen.

[Josh]

Josh, I just realized you might have really personal thoughts on this due to your first marriage. That’s totally okay & I get it. I have a brother with a ‘crazy ex-wife.’

I would appreciate it if you didn’t put words in my mouth about my ex-wife. She is married to someone else and has a child with him and I wish their child the very best.

Part of becoming a Christian for me was clearing out any unforgiveness or offence I might have had with my ex wife and making sure she truly knew I had a heart to reconcile if she wished. She didn’t, so the next part of being a Christian was maintaining charitable thoughts towards her and wishing her the best.

But I don’t know… I wouldn’t go thru all the trouble of becoming anabaptist if I was just going to turn around & lie about my husband. That’s me though.

I didn’t say you lied about anything.

I simply said I don’t think that we should ever automatically assume either the wife or husband is right and the other person the guilty party. “Believe all woman” isn’t something I do. I also don’t agree with people who want to always assume the husband is in the right. I have experienced people who do both extremes.

I seriously get you probably had a completely different experience, and your first wife might have totally been in the wrong.

I hope we can meet in the middle.

My opinions aren’t based on my own personal experience. The last time I got involved with a church situation, the husband was the one in the wrong and I stuck my neck out and spoke up and advocated for the wife.

I do just think, on some level, women *are* the weaker vessel (at least generally) & if they are asking for help, there’s a good chance things got pretty bad to make them brave enough to reach out.

I respect that is your opinion but I also respectfully submit that you are wrong. Both men and women are equally capable of being sinful, being abusers, being manipulative and so forth.

We can agree to disagree.

Especially (???) in anabaptist churches where, generally speaking, men have the upper hand.

This isn’t really true. The person who has the most well connected family (particularly a family which tends to “protect their own”) is usually the one with the upper hand. This could be the husband… or could be the wife.

To give you an idea of what I’m saying… consider your own son. Now consider that you might find that he ended up marrying someone who is manipulative and deceitful. (I sure hope not! But it’s possible.) Would you really want the standard to be “Believe all women”, and then meanwhile your son gets treated like an abuser simply because he’s the man in the situation?

[NedFlanders]

Thanks for sharing. I think gaining perspective is huge. My perspective is growing up with a mom who beat my dad. My dad being a strong man never hit back and tried his hardest to hide it. The day I saw it happen was the day I seen the most concern on his face - it devastated him that I saw and was terrified I would lose respect for my mom.

She often would say horrible accusations to him and when I would say something he would pull me aside and reassure me that it was only “the wrong time of the month and mom really didn’t mean it.” And later if I was still bothered and tried to bring it up my mom would act bewildered because she wouldn’t remember the things she said…. Hormones in woman I was told.

So when I got married and my wife often verbally attacked me and wrongly accused me of having abuse, threatened many times to leave and told me almost weekly for years she was planning on divorcing me but didn’t trust I wouldn’t do something crazy with our children - I just thought and still thought that is just how all woman are. To think of a woman not falsely accusing her husband and verbally attacking her husband regularly or at least from time to time is so far from any reality I’ve seen in these two examples and all the rest of my extended family that these testimonies are surprising to me.

[GoodGirl]

Josh, I just can’t, because I’ll become an emotional wreck.

I’m sorry.

Still friends, ok?