Should CA ministers, deacons, and bishops be paid?

[Josh]

I don't think I've ever advocated for salaried positions in conservative Anabaptist churches. I'm suggesting that those not in leadership initiate whatever support is needed for their church leaders to be able to fulfill their calling with the least amount of other cares getting in the way. If things are going well in the church and pastors do not need to spend much time in church work, then little financial support is needed.

Perhaps you and I's position might be closer than we think. I would support those not in leadership initiate funding whatever church jobs they feel are worthwhile, whether food committee, the person who organises serving meals at a homeless shelter, or preachers who need to go help another congregation and miss some time off from work.

I would argue, however, if a minister or deacon is so busy they have no time to work, then there need to be more ministers and deacons ordained.

[steve-in-kville]

I thought about this later. Our church does have a church part-time secretary. And our kitchen help is paid when they host groups in the fellowship hall (family reunions, wedding receptions, etc).

[Biblical Anabaptist]

Eastern and Pilgrim lift, I believe, quarterly offerings for ministerial aid. In Pilgrim, the bishops got double what the ministers (and I suppose the deacons were included) received. When a minister came from a distance to preach for a Sunday evening or a Winter Bible School message, they were paid a fixed amount (if I remember correctly it was $50.00) plus mileage. This was in addition to the Ministerial aid.
The ministerial aid offerings were never large. No one got rich from preaching.

It has been a number of years since I was a part of either Eastern or Pilgrim.

This sounds like what we do. Our church is of course derived from Eastern in the early 1980s, and I assume this is one of the various artifacts we have from our origins.

I thought of something else. Probably the closest we come to paying pastors is paying revival meeting speakers. I believe these payments can be thousands of dollars. I assume this is done because we are basically asking the speaker to take a week off work.

As I recall, a special offering is taken and the amount is given to the revival speaker.

[mike]

A good article on the subject:

https://www.truthaccordingtoscripture.c ... astors.php

First paragraph

Historically, pastors during the first-century period were normally not paid on a full-time basis. Although they may have periodically received gifts of food, clothing, and even some monetary assistance at times, there is no historical evidence to suggest that such pastors were given a full-time salary sufficient to meet their financial needs and obligations. This is confirmed by the following considerations:

[RZehr]

Eastern and Pilgrim lift, I believe, quarterly offerings for ministerial aid. In Pilgrim, the bishops got double what the ministers (and I suppose the deacons were included) received. When a minister came from a distance to preach for a Sunday evening or a Winter Bible School message, they were paid a fixed amount (if I remember correctly it was $50.00) plus mileage. This was in addition to the Ministerial aid.
The ministerial aid offerings were never large. No one got rich from preaching.

It has been a number of years since I was a part of either Eastern or Pilgrim.

Ah. The missing piece of the puzzle. Out here in the West we have generally a strong culture of every congregation having their own resident bishop. Not so with Eastern. Now I understand why. If something is incentivized, you shouldn’t expect it not to increase. Seems in Eastern bishops collect congregations like they are collectibles.

[RZehr]

I don't think I've ever advocated for salaried positions in conservative Anabaptist churches. I'm suggesting that those not in leadership initiate whatever support is needed for their church leaders to be able to fulfill their calling with the least amount of other cares getting in the way. If things are going well in the church and pastors do not need to spend much time in church work, then little financial support is needed.

But we want to talk about salaried preachers!

[ohio jones]

Eastern and Pilgrim lift, I believe, quarterly offerings for ministerial aid. In Pilgrim, the bishops got double what the ministers (and I suppose the deacons were included) received. When a minister came from a distance to preach for a Sunday evening or a Winter Bible School message, they were paid a fixed amount (if I remember correctly it was $50.00) plus mileage. This was in addition to the Ministerial aid.
The ministerial aid offerings were never large. No one got rich from preaching.

Eastern tends to operate as if Lancaster in 1950 was the kingdom of heaven, and tries to do things exactly like Lancaster did back then.

I'm guessing the amount of $50.00 was fixed in or before 1968 and will remain the same throughout eternity, inflation notwithstanding.

[Josh]

I vaguely recall that the church my brother goes to gives whoever preaches the sermon a modest amount (something like $50 maybe). Back when I attended there, one of the preachers was not particularly well paid, especially considering how hard he worked and the quality of his work, so I felt glad that he got a little extra cash since it took him time to prepare for sermons and takes up family time getting ready for church early, not being able to talk to dad when he's in his study, etc.

[Biblical Anabaptist]

Eastern and Pilgrim lift, I believe, quarterly offerings for ministerial aid. In Pilgrim, the bishops got double what the ministers (and I suppose the deacons were included) received. When a minister came from a distance to preach for a Sunday evening or a Winter Bible School message, they were paid a fixed amount (if I remember correctly it was $50.00) plus mileage. This was in addition to the Ministerial aid.
The ministerial aid offerings were never large. No one got rich from preaching.

Eastern tends to operate as if Lancaster in 1950 was the kingdom of heaven, and tries to do things exactly like Lancaster did back then.

I'm guessing the amount of $50.00 was fixed in or before 1968 and will remain the same throughout eternity, inflation notwithstanding.

I am not sure (1) if $50.00 was the amount and (2) when it was that I heard that figure. If I recall correctly, I think I was paid $600.00 for teaching 12 lessons of winter Bible School in my home congregation some 10 years ago. That was as a lay member.

[Neto]

Eastern and Pilgrim lift, I believe, quarterly offerings for ministerial aid. In Pilgrim, the bishops got double what the ministers (and I suppose the deacons were included) received. When a minister came from a distance to preach for a Sunday evening or a Winter Bible School message, they were paid a fixed amount (if I remember correctly it was $50.00) plus mileage. This was in addition to the Ministerial aid.
The ministerial aid offerings were never large. No one got rich from preaching.

Eastern tends to operate as if Lancaster in 1950 was the kingdom of heaven, and tries to do things exactly like Lancaster did back then.

I'm guessing the amount of $50.00 was fixed in or before 1968 and will remain the same throughout eternity, inflation notwithstanding.

I understand now that this is a mark of being 'conservative'. (And the minister in question must also be 'conservative', or he'll go into debt in the process, just paying for the food he eats on the trip there & back home.) I have to wonder what the mileage allowance is.....