Jacob Ammon & the "Martyrs Mirror"

Christian ethics and theology with an Anabaptist perspective
Ernie
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Re: Jacob Ammon & the "Martyrs Mirror"

Post by Ernie »

Neto wrote: Thu Dec 14, 2023 7:56 am
Ernie wrote: Wed Dec 13, 2023 5:56 pm Reist Mennonite surnames include:

Allgyer, Amstutz, Auker, Baer, Bear, Bauman, Bender, Bergey, Boll, Brenneman, Brubacher, Burkholder, Byers, Danner, Derstine, Diller, Eberly, Ebersole, Eby, Ehst, Eshbach, Eshleman, Faus, Fox, Freed, Frey, Funk, Gehman, Good, Groff, Halteman, Heatwole, Hege, High, Hoover, Horst, Hurst, Hostetter, Huber, Kreider, Landis, Lehman, Martin, Miller (Reist offspring), Moyer, Musser, Myers, Newswanger, Nolt, Reiff, Rhodes, Rodes, Rohrer, Rudolph, Sensenig, Shank, Shaum, Shirk, Showalter, Siegrist, Stauffer, Strite, Sweigart, Wadel, Weaver (Reist offspring), Weber, Wenger, Witmer, Zehr, Zeiset, Zimmerman

There are scores of thousands of these folks if not hundreds of thousands of these folks who are still non-resistant and non-conformed.
A question (or two):
Are the Reist Mennonites by any chance the ones that we "Russian Mennonites" always called "Old Mennonites"? (I am not referring to "Old COLONY Mennonites - that is something different, a group from my own people.) I had never heard this designation before.
Correct. Although the majority of Amish-Mennonites (Amman-Mennonites) had merged with the "Old Mennonites" or Mennonite Church from 1848-1866. This would have added large numbers of "Amman-Mennonite" surnames to the pool.
Neto wrote: Thu Dec 14, 2023 7:56 am Second, I see the name Funk in your list. I have Funk relatives, and it is a fairly common name in Plautdietsch circles. Do you know the genealogical/ethnic background for this family name?
EDIT: A third... Now I also see the name Wadel in your list. I wonder if there is a connection between Wadel and Wedel.
I don't know anything about these surnames.
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HondurasKeiser
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Re: Jacob Ammon & the "Martyrs Mirror"

Post by HondurasKeiser »

Ernie wrote: Wed Dec 13, 2023 5:56 pm Reist Mennonite surnames include:

Allgyer, Amstutz, Auker, Baer, Bear, Bauman, Bender, Bergey, Boll, Brenneman, Brubacher, Burkholder, Byers, Danner, Derstine, Diller, Eberly, Ebersole, Eby, Ehst, Eshbach, Eshleman, Faus, Fox, Freed, Frey, Funk, Gehman, Good, Groff, Halteman, Heatwole, Hege, High, Hoover, Horst, Hurst, Hostetter, Huber, Kreider, Landis, Lehman, Martin, Miller (Reist offspring), Moyer, Musser, Myers, Newswanger, Nolt, Reiff, Rhodes, Rodes, Rohrer, Rudolph, Sensenig, Shank, Shaum, Shirk, Showalter, Siegrist, Stauffer, Strite, Sweigart, Wadel, Weaver (Reist offspring), Weber, Wenger, Witmer, Zehr, Zeiset, Zimmerman

There are scores of thousands of these folks if not hundreds of thousands of these folks who are still non-resistant and non-conformed.
I've been in church, in school or in missions with the majority of these surnames.
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Judas Maccabeus
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Re: Jacob Ammon & the "Martyrs Mirror"

Post by Judas Maccabeus »

HondurasKeiser wrote: Thu Dec 14, 2023 8:25 am
Ernie wrote: Wed Dec 13, 2023 5:56 pm Reist Mennonite surnames include:

Allgyer, Amstutz, Auker, Baer, Bear, Bauman, Bender, Bergey, Boll, Brenneman, Brubacher, Burkholder, Byers, Danner, Derstine, Diller, Eberly, Ebersole, Eby, Ehst, Eshbach, Eshleman, Faus, Fox, Freed, Frey, Funk, Gehman, Good, Groff, Halteman, Heatwole, Hege, High, Hoover, Horst, Hurst, Hostetter, Huber, Kreider, Landis, Lehman, Martin, Miller (Reist offspring), Moyer, Musser, Myers, Newswanger, Nolt, Reiff, Rhodes, Rodes, Rohrer, Rudolph, Sensenig, Shank, Shaum, Shirk, Showalter, Siegrist, Stauffer, Strite, Sweigart, Wadel, Weaver (Reist offspring), Weber, Wenger, Witmer, Zehr, Zeiset, Zimmerman

There are scores of thousands of these folks if not hundreds of thousands of these folks who are still non-resistant and non-conformed.
I've been in church, in school or in missions with the majority of these surnames.
These seem to be the majority of. KMF as well.
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Heirbyadoption
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Re: Jacob Ammon & the "Martyrs Mirror"

Post by Heirbyadoption »

Yours truly traces back biologically through Burkholder, Eby, Eshleman, Kreider, Landis, Showalter, Witmer, and more. I am not aware of much/any Amish connections in my direct lines. Guess I'll need to look into that a bit more...
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Ernie
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Re: Jacob Ammon & the "Martyrs Mirror"

Post by Ernie »

I didn't intentionally leave any surnames out of the list. Just typed up those in the ministerial section of the CLP directory. I looked up a few to see if they indeed traced back to Switzerland or Germany. But yeah, feel free to add or subtract.
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The old woodcutter spoke again. “It is impossible to talk with you. You always draw conclusions. Life is so vast, yet you judge all of life with one page or one word. You see only a fragment. Unless you know the whole story, how can you judge?"
Neto
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Re: Jacob Ammon & the "Martyrs Mirror"

Post by Neto »

Ernie wrote: Thu Dec 14, 2023 8:04 am
Neto wrote: Thu Dec 14, 2023 7:56 am
Ernie wrote: Wed Dec 13, 2023 5:56 pm Reist Mennonite surnames include:
....
There are scores of thousands of these folks if not hundreds of thousands of these folks who are still non-resistant and non-conformed.
A question (or two):
Are the Reist Mennonites by any chance the ones that we "Russian Mennonites" always called "Old Mennonites"? (I am not referring to "Old COLONY Mennonites - that is something different, a group from my own people.) I had never heard this designation before.
Correct. Although the majority of Amish-Mennonites (Amman-Mennonites) had merged with the "Old Mennonites" or Mennonite Church from 1848-1866. This would have added large numbers of "Amman-Mennonite" surnames to the pool.
....
This just showed up on a FB group of which I am a member:
Hans de Ries (Dec. 13, 1553 - Sept. 14, 1638).
Dutch Mennonite minister. Pacifist. Peacemaker. Longtime pastor of the Waterlander congregation in Alkmaar, Netherlands.
As someone with spiritualist leanings, Hans was not keen on constitutions, regulations, or even sacraments. Nor did he have much use for disciplinary measures, like the ban. He preached love and peace, and urged Mennonites to get over their disagreements. He spent much of his career working -- unsuccessfully -- for the unification of all Dutch Mennonite groups.
Hans introduced the practice of admitting members of the Reformed Church into the Mennonite fold without requiring them to be rebaptized. The traditional Mennonites of the day (the Frisians and the Flemish) criticized him for his ecumenical leanings.
Hans was a collector of Anabaptist martyr stories. In 1615 he published "History of the Martyrs," the most comprehensive Anabaptist martyr book up to that time. Forty-five years later, in 1660, T.J. van Braght used Hans's book as the basis for his massive volume, known today as "Martyrs' Mirror."
Born in Antwerp, Belgium. Died in Alkmaar, Netherlands. Laid to rest in the Groote Kerk (Reformed Church) of Alkmaar.
~The Marginal Mennonite Society Heroes Series
So, is the Hans Reist to whom you refer the same as this Hans de Ries? Reis was a Dutch Mennonite, but one who came after Menno Simons (approximately 7 years old when Menno died). I didn't recall having heard of him, but have probably just forgotten. Anyway, IF this is the same man as the Reist to whom you refer, how did "your Mennonites' respond to his attitude toward infant baptism? (See bolded above.)
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ohio jones
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Re: Jacob Ammon & the "Martyrs Mirror"

Post by ohio jones »

Neto wrote: Mon Dec 18, 2023 1:51 pm So, is the Hans Reist to whom you refer the same as this Hans de Ries?
No, Reist and de Ries were separated by both geography and time.
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Neto
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Re: Jacob Ammon & the "Martyrs Mirror"

Post by Neto »

ohio jones wrote: Mon Dec 18, 2023 2:21 pm
Neto wrote: Mon Dec 18, 2023 1:51 pm So, is the Hans Reist to whom you refer the same as this Hans de Ries?
No, Reist and de Ries were separated by both geography and time.
Well, that's good to hear, because de Ries sounds like a heri.... Well, I guess I won't say that.
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Josh
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Re: Jacob Ammon & the "Martyrs Mirror"

Post by Josh »

Neto wrote: Mon Dec 18, 2023 3:19 pm
ohio jones wrote: Mon Dec 18, 2023 2:21 pm
Neto wrote: Mon Dec 18, 2023 1:51 pm So, is the Hans Reist to whom you refer the same as this Hans de Ries?
No, Reist and de Ries were separated by both geography and time.
Well, that's good to hear, because de Ries sounds like a heri.... Well, I guess I won't say that.
It would be safe to say he wasn’t Anabaptist.
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