The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

Christian ethics and theology with an Anabaptist perspective
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PeterG
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Re: The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

Post by PeterG »

Wayne in Maine wrote:What is more important is to consider the real diversity of beliefs and practices of the groups Broadbent (and others) have tried to link together. They were not all "Baptist" in theology or "Anabaptist" in practice.
^This.
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Judas Maccabeus
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Re: The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

Post by Judas Maccabeus »

Wayne in Maine wrote:Broadbent was not original in proposing an underground apostolic lineage of churches. I don't recall the author, but there was a German scholar in the 19th century on who proposed the same thing and who outlined the historic connectivity of these different groups. John Horsch accepted the connection of the Waldensians to the Anabaptist as outlined in this work, but later scholars disputed the connection, simply by pointing to the fact that the Waldensians had died out entirely in the regions where supposedly they have contacted and influenced the first generation of Anabaptists.

What is more important is to consider the real diversity of beliefs and practices of the groups Broadbent (and others) have tried to link together. They were not all "Baptist" in theology or "Anabaptist" in practice.
If you think Broadbent is the only one, I remember a chart like this one below from Baptist Training Union, right after I professed faith in Christ. Look at the diverse groups it claims:

Image

If the image does not paste:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baptist ... _Blood.jpg

J.M.
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PeterG
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Re: The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

Post by PeterG »

Here's the image Judas referred to.

Image
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Hats Off
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Re: The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

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So doesn't that chart make the claim that the Baptists alone are the one true church? They alone have never deviated in claiming/proclaiming the blood of Jesus?
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Josh
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Re: The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

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My favourite part of that chart is when he flatly declares "In the 16th century the Ana-Baptists dropped the Ana and simply started being called Baptists."

It is impressive the degree to which someone will distort history in order to support their point of view.
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Judas Maccabeus
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Re: The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

Post by Judas Maccabeus »

Hats Off wrote:So doesn't that chart make the claim that the Baptists alone are the one true church? They alone have never deviated in claiming/proclaiming the blood of Jesus?
Yes, it does. Most of them will not hold this sort of view today. It can mostly be found among regular and primitive baptists. Some independent baptists would also. It is sometimes termed "Baptist Bride" theology. It has gotten less common in recent years, although my old C&MA church could not participate in a IFB citywide effort, because we were not "Baptist" even though our theology was very close. It ties in with the view of these folks of separation , which in their view is more organizational than in practice/lifestyle.

Many baptist churches have gone reformed in recent years. This puts them more clearly in the stream of the magisterial reformation than ever.

J.M.
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Judas Maccabeus
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Re: The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

Post by Judas Maccabeus »

Josh wrote:My favourite part of that chart is when he flatly declares "In the 16th century the Ana-Baptists dropped the Ana and simply started being called Baptists."

It is impressive the degree to which someone will distort history in order to support their point of view.
I figured you would find this interesting. I am beginning to think that maybe COGICM may have borrowed some of this stuff from the Hardshells. The timing is just about right.

J.M.

Very few ideas are ever original.
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Wade
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Re: The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

Post by Wade »

Is there any denomination that doesn't sway history when they write it to make themselves sound good?

When we look at scripture, the church had many issues. I think this was just being humble and honest.
For more thoughts on this look up David Bercot - "What True Greatness Looks Like"


I believe Peter Hoover was very honest in, "The Secret of the Strength." - That is a good read.
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Josh
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Re: The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

Post by Josh »

Judas Maccabeus wrote:
Josh wrote:My favourite part of that chart is when he flatly declares "In the 16th century the Ana-Baptists dropped the Ana and simply started being called Baptists."

It is impressive the degree to which someone will distort history in order to support their point of view.
I figured you would find this interesting. I am beginning to think that maybe COGICM may have borrowed some of this stuff from the Hardshells. The timing is just about right.

J.M.

Very few ideas are ever original.
John Holdeman was more influenced by the Church of God movement, which doesn't seem to have crossed over at all with Landmarkism or Baptist Bride thinking.

The overall mindset is the same, but by necessity each focuses on a different "lineage".
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Judas Maccabeus
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Re: The Pilgrim Church, E. Hamer Broadbent

Post by Judas Maccabeus »

Copy of "The Torch of the Testimony" arrives tomorrow. Reading list getting backed up. :D
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