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Hats Off wrote:

Sudsy wrote:It would be interesting to know what those who don't follow say, 10% of net income plus additional offerings really do give in this regard to their net income. Do non-tithers end up giving more than tithers+ or less ?

The answer is probably yes!

Depends on whether you are talking about conservative Anabaptists or other denominations. In general, conservative Anabaptists are known to give a lot.
At the more conservative end of the spectrum, all it takes is a postcard in the mail and they open up their wallets. On the more progressive end of the spectrum, banquets, slideshows, full color newsletters, etc, are needed to get more people to give.

Contrast this with most churches in America where it takes coaxing, expensive fundraisers, and multiple sermons on giving to get people to give.

Ernie wrote:

Hats Off wrote:

Sudsy wrote:It would be interesting to know what those who don't follow say, 10% of net income plus additional offerings really do give in this regard to their net income. Do non-tithers end up giving more than tithers+ or less ?

The answer is probably yes!

Depends on whether you are talking about conservative Anabaptists or other denominations. In general, conservative Anabaptists are known to give a lot.
At the more conservative end of the spectrum, all it takes is a postcard in the mail and they open up their wallets. On the more progressive end of the spectrum, banquets, slideshows, full color newsletters, etc, are needed to get more people to give.

Contrast this with most churches in America where it takes coaxing, expensive fundraisers, and multiple sermons on giving to get people to give.

I admit I am a new, but my observation is that nothing opens conservative mennonite wallets quite like education, brotherly aid and missions.

J.M.

Not to mention a person in need. I've got a ways to go to balance the books in terms of all the help I've received.

Josh wrote:Ah yes, trying to apply the Old Testament when the Jews had an actual temple to today... we don't have a "storehouse" to give to.

In New Testament life we should live as if all of our things are God's and we are just stewards. He wants 100%, not 10%.

Thanks for bringing this up.

Our "tithes" should go to widows and orphans. Yep, there I said it. Nobody really follows this because it would create too much of an issue. If we did, I don't know what would happen.

Also Jews tithed twice a year, not every week.

Chris wrote:

Josh wrote:Ah yes, trying to apply the Old Testament when the Jews had an actual temple to today... we don't have a "storehouse" to give to.

In New Testament life we should live as if all of our things are God's and we are just stewards. He wants 100%, not 10%.

Thanks for bringing this up.

Our "tithes" should go to widows and orphans. Yep, there I said it. Nobody really follows this because it would create too much of an issue. If we did, I don't know what would happen.

Also Jews tithed twice a year, not every week.

I'm curious Chris. Where do you get in scripture what I highlighted above ?

https://churchwatchcentral.com/2016/03/ ... g-stickup/

A worthwhile read I think...

Ernie wrote:https://churchwatchcentral.com/2016/03/ ... g-stickup/

A worthwhile read I think...

Good read, Ernie. I grew up under pleads for monies, sometimes 3 offerings back to back and counted until a certain number was reached. 2 Cor 9:7 NLT - "You must each decide in your heart how much to give. And don't give reluctantly or in response to pressure. "For God loves a person who gives cheerfully."" Seems to me pressured giving is not what God desires.

I like that idea of having locked boxes available instead of taking up a collection. Whenever I suggested something like that I was told that giving our offerings was part of worship. However, now, at least in our MB church, we can have bank transfers out of our personal bank accounts for our giving. No Sunday act of worship here for those of us who use this method. Every Sunday prior to passing the offering bags, they announce that "if you are here as a guest this collection is not for you so feel no obligation to give. It is for those making this their home church".

What bothers me even more than how giving is collected is how givings are used. I wish I could designate my offering more specifically to areas I believe are helping to further the Kingdom not in areas of adding to our comforts where we gather. So, we split out givings to areas we know will make the most direct contribution to real needs outside the local church.

Many Plain Mennonites are exempt from paying Social Security tax.
I think there is a moral obligation to give that money and not keep it.

Chris wrote:

Josh wrote:Ah yes, trying to apply the Old Testament when the Jews had an actual temple to today... we don't have a "storehouse" to give to.

In New Testament life we should live as if all of our things are God's and we are just stewards. He wants 100%, not 10%.

Thanks for bringing this up.

Our "tithes" should go to widows and orphans. Yep, there I said it. Nobody really follows this because it would create too much of an issue. If we did, I don't know what would happen.

Also Jews tithed twice a year, not every week.

Tithing was 'pre' temple, 'pre' Mosaic law- tithe literally means 10% by definition but of course it is not limited to 10%- but it was given by Abram centuries before the law was given to Moses.
Who told Abraham to give Melchizadek, the High Priest of God (fulfilled in Christ) a tithe? this took place before God established Israel & the Mosaic Laws-

Genesis 14:
17 And the king of Sodom went out to meet him after his return from the slaughter of Chedorlaomer, and of the kings that were with him, at the valley of Shaveh, which is the king's dale.
18 And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the most high God.
19 And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram of the most high God, possessor of heaven and earth:
20 And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And Abram gave him atithe of all.

There are 'tithes' and 'offerings' - but tithes were pre "law" and carried into the New Covenant Church as well as offerings so there really is no limitation-

Valerie wrote: Tithing was 'pre' temple, 'pre' Mosaic law- tithe literally means 10% by definition but of course it is not limited to 10%- but it was given by Abram centuries before the law was given to Moses.
Who told Abraham to give Melchizadek, the High Priest of God (fulfilled in Christ) a tithe? this took place before God established Israel & the Mosaic Laws-

Genesis 14:
17 And the king of Sodom went out to meet him after his return from the slaughter of Chedorlaomer, and of the kings that were with him, at the valley of Shaveh, which is the king's dale.
18 And Melchizedek king of Salem brought forth bread and wine: and he was the priest of the most high God.
19 And he blessed him, and said, Blessed be Abram of the most high God, possessor of heaven and earth:
20 And blessed be the most high God, which hath delivered thine enemies into thy hand. And Abram gave him atithe of all.

There are 'tithes' and 'offerings' - but tithes were pre "law" and carried into the New Covenant Church as well as offerings so there really is no limitation-

Interesting to me how 'tithing' is not thought of by some as a tenth. In our MB church I have heard a sermon that the tenth idea is no longer a NT practise but recently our teaching pastor, from a Pentecostal background, preached that it is. When I looked up an article in the MB Herald it says this 'God is more interested in the heart than in the amount'. 'Tithing' is spoken more of setting aside an amount and the word 'tithe' and 'giving' seem to be used interchangeably.

http://mbherald.com/10-tips-tithing/

Valerie, here is some 'push back' on tithes being pre law. Questions arise such as - Just because Abraham tithed to Mel was it a command of God before the law ? Did God require Abraham to tithe ? Why did Abraham tithe ? What did Abraham actually tithe ? To whom did Abraham give this tithe to ? Some have suggested answers to these questions but are they obvious in what we read ? We are warned not to add to scripture. In the what did Abraham tithe it reads as though Abraham tithed the spoils of the war he just won. Taking people's goods and kid napping people. I do think history supports the idea that tithing was a practise prior to the law by some kingdoms like the Babylonians but can we build a doctrine on this one statement that Abraham tithed as God required him to do and this supports tithing as a pre law practise ? Could Abraham be following the practise of his culture in how kings were treated ? He tithed but not of his own property. And we don't read that he ever tithed again. Jacob promised to give a tenth but there is no recording he ever did.

I think if tithing was to continue as a NT practise in the New Covenant period, this verse would read much differently than it does. Are we to take for granted that the early church tithed beyond this instruction on giving ?

1 Corinthians 16:2: “On the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with his income.”

After Pentecost there just isn't any reference to giving a tithed, a tenth so it would seem this was an Old Covenant practise. Actually, for those blessed with much, a tenth is too little to give considering what one is left to live with.