That could be an interesting thread as I would like to hear others views on what is meant by a messenger of satan that came to buffet Paul. I often wonder why it is termed as a 'messenger of satan' and what some believe who gave to Paul this 'thorn'. Does God give these kind of gifts to Jesus followers. If not why not use the words 'God allowed' ? Anyway that is another subject, sorry.KingdomBuilder wrote:I'll keep up with this thread. I was thinking last night of creating a thread called "Thorn in the flesh".. It would've paralleled some of what the OP alluded to.
Overcoming sin
Re: Overcoming sin
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- gcdonner
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Re: Overcoming sin
So someone start another thread? I'll take a poke at that thorny issue.Sudsy wrote:That could be an interesting thread as I would like to hear others views on what is meant by a messenger of satan that came to buffet Paul. I often wonder why it is termed as a 'messenger of satan' and what some believe who gave to Paul this 'thorn'. Does God give these kind of gifts to Jesus followers. If not why not use the words 'God allowed' ? Anyway that is another subject, sorry.KingdomBuilder wrote:I'll keep up with this thread. I was thinking last night of creating a thread called "Thorn in the flesh".. It would've paralleled some of what the OP alluded to.
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rightly dividing the word of truth.
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Re: Overcoming sin
It seems like Apostle Paul explained it very well?gcdonner wrote:So someone start another thread? I'll take a poke at that thorny issue.Sudsy wrote:That could be an interesting thread as I would like to hear others views on what is meant by a messenger of satan that came to buffet Paul. I often wonder why it is termed as a 'messenger of satan' and what some believe who gave to Paul this 'thorn'. Does God give these kind of gifts to Jesus followers. If not why not use the words 'God allowed' ? Anyway that is another subject, sorry.KingdomBuilder wrote:I'll keep up with this thread. I was thinking last night of creating a thread called "Thorn in the flesh".. It would've paralleled some of what the OP alluded to.
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- gcdonner
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Re: Overcoming sin
If Paul explained it so well, then why is there so much disagreement on what the "thorn in the flesh" was? I know of at least 4 different ideas floating around, and all with some basis in truth.Valerie wrote:It seems like Apostle Paul explained it very well?gcdonner wrote: So someone start another thread? I'll take a poke at that thorny issue.
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Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed
rightly dividing the word of truth.
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Re: Overcoming sin
I meant WHY he was given the thorn in the flesh- it doesn't really matter what it was- but he explained very well why he was allowed to have it-gcdonner wrote:If Paul explained it so well, then why is there so much disagreement on what the "thorn in the flesh" was? I know of at least 4 different ideas floating around, and all with some basis in truth.Valerie wrote:It seems like Apostle Paul explained it very well?gcdonner wrote: So someone start another thread? I'll take a poke at that thorny issue.
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Re: Overcoming sin
The greatest command is love. We are commanded to love the Lord our God and to love our neighbour as ourself. On this hang the law and the prophets. This command predated Jesus' birth, but he did show us what true love actually looks like.
By "tempting" I mean my initial goal of being a Christian was to sin less: be nicer to people, keep more promises, and generally be a "good person".
God had something else in mind for me. He wanted me to learn his two greatest commands. That's the whole point of all of this.
By "tempting" I mean my initial goal of being a Christian was to sin less: be nicer to people, keep more promises, and generally be a "good person".
God had something else in mind for me. He wanted me to learn his two greatest commands. That's the whole point of all of this.
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- gcdonner
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Re: Overcoming sin
I misunderstood this perspective, Josh. Sorry if I went off in the wrong direction.Josh wrote:The greatest command is love. We are commanded to love the Lord our God and to love our neighbour as ourself. On this hang the law and the prophets. This command predated Jesus' birth, but he did show us what true love actually looks like.
By "tempting" I mean my initial goal of being a Christian was to sin less: be nicer to people, keep more promises, and generally be a "good person".
God had something else in mind for me. He wanted me to learn his two greatest commands. That's the whole point of all of this.
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Study to show thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed
rightly dividing the word of truth.
rightly dividing the word of truth.
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Re: Overcoming sin
Good words Josh- I too thought you were focusing on 'how to overcome sins' but really reading your initial post, that was not your objective- I understand what you are saying- sorry for thinking it was more about how to help people overcome sins-gcdonner wrote:I misunderstood this perspective, Josh. Sorry if I went off in the wrong direction.Josh wrote:The greatest command is love. We are commanded to love the Lord our God and to love our neighbour as ourself. On this hang the law and the prophets. This command predated Jesus' birth, but he did show us what true love actually looks like.
By "tempting" I mean my initial goal of being a Christian was to sin less: be nicer to people, keep more promises, and generally be a "good person".
God had something else in mind for me. He wanted me to learn his two greatest commands. That's the whole point of all of this.
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Re: Overcoming sin
Keep in mind that how I live, and my church lives, is that we abstain from photography, recorded music, and live instruments as part of our quest to live holy lives.
But it would be a huge mistake to confuse not doing those things with "overcoming sin". Our goal is to obey the "Greatest Command".
If I'm lusting, I'm not loving very well. That is where the sin lies: knowing the right thing to do and not doing it.
Jesus & the Holy Ghost give us the power to love - even to love our enemies.
But it would be a huge mistake to confuse not doing those things with "overcoming sin". Our goal is to obey the "Greatest Command".
If I'm lusting, I'm not loving very well. That is where the sin lies: knowing the right thing to do and not doing it.
Jesus & the Holy Ghost give us the power to love - even to love our enemies.
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- JimFoxvog
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Re: Overcoming sin
Jesus gave two summaries of the law. Love God and your neighbor has been referred to. The other is in Matthew 7.12:
[bible]Matthew 7,12[/bible]
This helps us think in very practical terms. Sometimes we don't feel like loving someone who is doing wrong. But we can pray for them and obey the golden rule.
But the deeper answer is that Jesus has overcome sin, and we are in Christ.
[bible]Matthew 7,12[/bible]
This helps us think in very practical terms. Sometimes we don't feel like loving someone who is doing wrong. But we can pray for them and obey the golden rule.
But the deeper answer is that Jesus has overcome sin, and we are in Christ.
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