Nonresistance

[twinpines]

While most conservative Anabaptist would still consider themselves non-resistant, I have studied the writings of the early anabaptist writers and early confessions such as the Dordrecht confession. It seems from conversations with leaders across the conservative mennonite spectrum whether its Midwest, Bethel, Nationwide that mennonites no longer hold the original values. Non-resistance has morphed into more of a no involvement in government/military belief. Nowadays not one leader I have met would have problems with owning guns or calling the police because someone stole your tractor.

Menno Simon's talked against owning swords and spears. Also the Dordrecht confession talks about suffering the spoiling of our goods, returning good for evil. Not calling the police to revenge for us. My question is, when did this shift occur and what implications does it have on the faith?

[Josh]

While most conservative Anabaptist would still consider themselves non-resistant, I have studied the writings of the early anabaptist writers and early confessions such as the Dordrecht confession. It seems from conversations with leaders across the conservative mennonite spectrum whether its Midwest, Bethel, Nationwide that mennonites no longer hold the original values. Non-resistance has morphed into more of a no involvement in government/military belief. Nowadays not one leader I have met would have problems with owning guns

In my conference, owning handguns or military-style weapons is not acceptable for a church member. There has never been any objection to owning hunting rifles or other types of common equipment rural people own and use in Mennonite circles.

or calling the police because someone stole your tractor.

Generally speaking, Mennonites did not historically think we should disobey Romans 13, although you can certainly find Amish or Mennonite groups who think it's wrong to call the police if, say, you find out that someone has molested a child. Personally, I think the government should be notified when crimes are committed.

Menno Simon's talked against owning swords and spears. Also the Dordrecht confession talks about suffering the spoiling of our goods, returning good for evil. Not calling the police to revenge for us. My question is, when did this shift occur and what implications does it have on the faith?

I think you're imagining a shift that didn't happen. When and how to notify the magistrate has always been an open question; some groups like the Amish took a stricter stance to never call the authorities at all.

In the 16th century, the government was often the one taking Mennonites' property away, and the confession teaches about accepting that. That doesn't mean that we should promote theft. The Bible says, "Let him who stole, steal no longer."

[joshuabgood]

While this doesn't fully answer your question, not study of Mennonite's and nonresistance is complete without a close read of this book. I highly recommend it as an excellent work.
https://www.amazon.com/Nonresistance-J ... 0836195086

[Josh]

While this doesn't fully answer your question, not study of Mennonite's and nonresistance is complete without a close read of this book. I highly recommend it as an excellent work.
https://www.amazon.com/Nonresistance-J ... 0836195086

This is an excellent book, and has basically informed my viewpoint of how I interpret Josh Good himself’s migration from plain Anabaptist nonresistance to the peace/justice viewpoint, along with his contemporaries such as the Kingdom Christian factions.

[joshuabgood]

While this doesn't fully answer your question, not study of Mennonite's and nonresistance is complete without a close read of this book. I highly recommend it as an excellent work.
https://www.amazon.com/Nonresistance-J ... 0836195086

This is an excellent book, and has basically informed my viewpoint of how I interpret Josh Good himself’s migration from plain Anabaptist nonresistance to the peace/justice viewpoint, along with his contemporaries such as the Kingdom Christian factions.

There are similarities but there are some big differences between my viewpoint and the one where MC USA landed. Their critique though of the passive nonresistance was spot on. However them embracing the means of the state to bring about peace and justice is where I part ways.

[Ernie]

along with his contemporaries such as the Kingdom Christian factions.

Who are the Kingdom Christian factions?

[Ken]

There are similarities but there are some big differences between my viewpoint and the one where MC USA landed. Their critique though of the passive nonresistance was spot on. However them embracing the means of the state to bring about peace and justice is where I part ways.

Where do you think MCUSA landed? Are you talking about the MCUSA Confession of Faith?

http://mennoniteusa.org/confession-of-f ... esistance/
and this? http://mennoniteusa.org/confession-of-f ... d-society/

Or is there some other MCUSA doctrine you are referring to?

[steve-in-kville]

In my conference, owning handguns or military-style weapons is not acceptable for a church member. There has never been any objection to owning hunting rifles or other types of common equipment rural people own and use in Mennonite circles.

I see the wisdom in that thinking but I feel its a bit outdated, and perhaps I should start another thread on the matter. I am a gun owner, own handguns as well as a semi-auto rifle.

As some here know, I dig trains as well as airplanes, and especially bush planes/pilots. (I also like Cold War era stuff, too!) I watched a documentary about and Alaskan bush pilot and he had a Glock .45 in a chest holster.... for bears.

[JimFoxvog]

Where do you think MCUSA landed? Are you talking about the MCUSA Confession of Faith?

http://mennoniteusa.org/confession-of-f ... esistance/
and this? http://mennoniteusa.org/confession-of-f ... d-society/

...

Thanks for posting this reference, Ken. I was thinking of doing the same. This is the sort of statement that made me glad to become a Mennonite.

[barnhart]

Menno Simon's talked against owning swords and spears. Also the Dordrecht confession talks about suffering the spoiling of our goods, returning good for evil. Not calling the police to revenge for us. My question is, when did this shift occur and what implications does it have on the faith?

I think this is a good observation and a good question. My answer would be the shift occurs as Kingdom minded people move from a stranger and pilgrim identity into a full national citizenship, or dual citizenship as it is commonly called. Strangers and pilgrims do not have rights as citizens do, and rights are undefinable without law and enforcement and enforcement is undefinable without violence or the threat of violence.

My experience is slowly growing less likely to involve police as I have had more opportunity to see how they operate, but I still see a place for it. When my car was stolen, I reported it to the police, not in hopes of recovery but to guard against liability in case it was taken for use in committing other crime. I think the motive behind reporting or involving law enforcement is important.