S. Stutzman claims 67% of Anabaptist women have been sexually abused

[hillperson]

Silent no More by Carolyn Burkholder is a book that I would recommend. It’s a story of a Mennonite girl in Southern Ontario who suffered abuse and how she found healing

Also Joy for Mourning by Ann Miller is a very good book on the subject

[Judas Maccabeus]

Having said that, I've also noticed that it is pretty popular today for people to come out of the closet with a story, and maybe even write a book. So, like most such things, I'm guessing that truth to be somewhere in between. I also know a woman who wrote a book on her experiences who didn't even remember that she had been abused until the counselor suggested it. Eventually, after some prodding, her memories came flooding back. Were they real? Or only provoked by the power of suggestion? Who knows, but even non-Christian counselors are speaking up about such possibilities.

Lester:

No, that is a well documented possibility. Here is one that ruined a few lives due to counseling malpractice:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/McMartin_preschool_trial

This is a writeup on that process:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recovered-memory_therapy

Frankly, I would never see a counselor unless they were properly trained AND in general reject Nouthetic counseling.

J.M.

[ragpicker]

Frankly, I would never see a counselor unless they were properly trained AND in general reject Nouthetic counseling.

J.M.

Would you be comfortable sending people to Rene Rivera at Shepherd's Fold?

[ragpicker]

First off, I will CONTINUE to question that statistic. Many, if not most, conservative churches in PA have implemented a rather comprehensive policy in the light of the laws passed after the Jerry Sandusky incident. This originated from the EPMC, but our conference follows the same policies. Do they make it impossible....no. Do they make it far more difficult, absolutely. Any leader of a conservative church in PA is likely to be able to get you a copy.

Do I believe some of this goes on in conservative churches....absolutely. Does it go on in most places in our society, again absolutely. Does it go on in other churches, absolutely. We just got over a HUGE scandal with group called Sovereign Grace down here. There are entire blogs devoted to exposing this in evangelical churches. Is one case of this far too many, absolutely. What one sees personally affects ones view of it, and if it happens to you, or in your church it will appear like it happens everywhere, all the time. Is there any empirical evidence that it is anywhere near that high, or even approaching it? None has been offered, only N=1 stories. Does this guy have a slanted view?

https://www.facebook.com/straitpathsfoundation/

Scroll down. When you sell seats at a conference for almost 200$ a head to solve the latent effects of this sort of problem, this make me wonder a bit. If people willing to pay that much are the ones you have the most contact with, I would venture to say that your sample is badly skewed.

I have not seen a shred of proof that it is as big of a problem as he makes it out to be? No, and I am open to listening to someone who has actually done the hard work rather than guessing.

J.M.

Let's deal with the charge for these conferences since it's been brought up twice, then maybe we can move on to things that really matter. It's usually a break even or money losing proposition. Now you may not like the conferences themselves, and I am OK with that. But they are far from a money making scheme. They are subsidized by other sources. So with this information, can we drop that part and move on?

[Josh]

Stutzman has an immense amount of power, can’t be questioned, and anyone who tries gets severe repercussions (like happened to me). Hmm.

In the situation I encountered, a wife would barricade herself with her two daughters at night in their bedroom and keep a cell phone fully charged up by their bedside.

My reward for questioning how this could be okay was being referred to Stutzman for counselling, who told me:

1. A wife’s duty is always to submit - the wife is in the wrong for telling her husband “no”

2. The wife has a “Jezebel spirit” and a “rebellious spirit”

3. I have an “accusatory spirit” and a “rebellious spirit” for even questioning these things.

4. The fact I did not agree with Stutzman on these things meant I don’t have the Holy Spirit and that I am probably not even saved.

5. I am probably hiding some secret sexual sin.

6. Two years down the road, and this wife’s husband is cavorting with a 19 year old girl at Stutzman’s conferences, complete with the hugging/holding thing going on that Stutzman promotes.

7. To this day, any attempt to talk about it with a Stutzman devotee gets me called a liar (like happened with ragpicker here).

If any of you want names and pictures, I’ll share. Some of this stuff is blatantly obvious to those of us who are NMB. And that’s why we are such a threat to people like Stutzman. A real life NMB friend of mine noticed #5 and sent it to me - and he didn’t even know who Stutzman was. Someone just invited him to a conference.

My recovery process to get over this was:

1. I went back to a LICENCED, professional counsellor who has an LPCC. I had previously gone to her when going through a divorce. She helped get my thinking clear and back where it should be again.

2. A Beachy background minister in Australia really helped me get over and let go of this stuff.

3. Ministers at a CMC church and at Oneness Pentecostal churches helped me trust church, God, and get back on the straight and narrow again.

I will not be silent.

[Josh]

Let's deal with the charge for these conferences since it's been brought up twice, then maybe we can move on to things that really matter. It's usually a break even or money losing proposition. Now you may not like the conferences themselves, and I am OK with that. But they are far from a money making scheme. They are subsidized by other sources. So with this information, can we drop that part and move on?

Other conservative groups put on conferences for free and have a freewill offering, or Else (like KFW) have a very modest charge for lodging. I can think of dozens of conferences like this.

Other conservative groups don’t hold their conference on a cruise ship.

[justme]

so what is the purpose of this thread?
josh's butthurt over one person?
or a discussion on sexual abuse/molestation?

[ragpicker]

so what is the purpose of this thread?
josh's butthurt over one person?
or a discussion on sexual abuse/molestation?

The answer is clear.

[ragpicker]

My reward for questioning how this could be okay was being referred to Stutzman for counselling, who told me:

You never went to Stutzman for counseling. I don't know why you claim you did. Perhaps to give your other claims credibility? I don't know.

[ragpicker]

Other conservative groups put on conferences for free and have a freewill offering, or Else (like KFW) have a very modest charge for lodging. I can think of dozens of conferences like this.

First you complained that they charge exorbitant prices (insinuating profits are made) and I told you all their conferences have to be subsidized by other sources (including freewill offerings). So now you switch gears and complain about their model. Apparently charging a very reasonable fee per person and then making up the difference in cost with freewill offerings is not good enough for you. What is it that you want Josh?

Other conservative groups don’t hold their conference on a cruise ship.

Neither does Stutzman. So why are you falsely insinuating he does?

Look, you don't like Steve Stutzman. I get that. I have plenty of other friends that don't. I have plenty of other friends that do. Either way, it doesn't bother me in the least. I don't go around defending him or praising him. It is what it is. I got involved here for several reasons, most are better left unsaid. I would ask for honesty about your motivations and in your accusations.

I don't know what Steve did or didn't tell you. Some of what you claimed he said, with the slant you give it, is 180 degrees from everything I have ever heard him say and teach. I do know that the situation you speak of is a messy situation and it's not been resolved. I am not defending the man you speak of. I don't know what Steve did or didn't tell you about the matter, and I suppose it's possible Steve made mistakes.

I have a proposal. Let's get the man you speak of, his boys, you, and Steve in a room together, with a fair moderator, and let's get this resolved. Would you be open to that?