Impediments to membership in an Anabaptist fellowship

[RZehr]

In a transitional Anabaptist setting, as people who think they are "plain" or "conservative" are gradually becoming more worldly, it is not uncommon to see them start to pick up stereotypically worldly hobbies like playing golf.

Some of that, to its defense, comes from the corporate world. As Mennonite businesses grow, they get invited to golf outings, paid cruises and the like. If you want to maintain your relationships, you gotta go with the flow.

Or you just don’t go with the flow.

In my industry, the golf course and outdoor sports fields are are important customers of our products. Almost every convention in the US (2-4 per year) there is an afternoon of golfing. Additionally, sales people will golf with customers.
Between the lack of drinking, and the lack of golfing, we compete with a major handicap.

The church I was raised in did allow golfing when I was a teen, but no one really played. Then golfing was banned for maybe a couple decades. Part of the reason it was banned, was because it was being played too much (I think).Now I think it is allowed again.
My current church doesn’t allow it. We voted and opted to keep the golf ban.

The logic I’ve heard for allowing it, is that golfing has largely lost its reputation as a sport only for the rich. With the rise of municipal courses, rental clubs, what all, it is now more of a middle class sport. So I guess that mean we are more comfortable associating with middle class sensibilities and norms and values, and have a bit of discomfort with the upper crust.

[Ken]

In a transitional Anabaptist setting, as people who think they are "plain" or "conservative" are gradually becoming more worldly, it is not uncommon to see them start to pick up stereotypically worldly hobbies like playing golf.

Some of that, to its defense, comes from the corporate world. As Mennonite businesses grow, they get invited to golf outings, paid cruises and the like. If you want to maintain your relationships, you gotta go with the flow.

Or you just don’t go with the flow.

In my industry, the golf course and outdoor sports fields are are important customers of our products. Almost every convention in the US (2-4 per year) there is an afternoon of golfing. Additionally, sales people will golf with customers.
Between the lack of drinking, and the lack of golfing, we compete with a major handicap.

The church I was raised in did allow golfing when I was a teen, but no one really played. Then golfing was banned for maybe a couple decades. Part of the reason it was banned, was because it was being played too much (I think).Now I think it is allowed again.
My current church doesn’t allow it. We voted and opted to keep the golf ban.

The logic I’ve heard for allowing it, is that golfing has largely lost its reputation as a sport only for the rich. With the rise of municipal courses, rental clubs, what all, it is now more of a middle class sport. So I guess that mean we are more comfortable associating with middle class sensibilities and norms and values, and have a bit of discomfort with the upper crust.

I would say that what is really happening is that golf is becoming less popular as a national sport and so the golf industry in the past decade or so has been scrambling to widen its appeal and doing everything they can to make it more diverse and less "old rich white male". The golf industry is also finding that tying upscale subdivisions together with golf courses which was popular in decades past is no longer a big selling point. In the 1980s and 1990s every big new upscale subdivision in the south was built around a golf course and golf club which gave both the neighborhood and golf club a sense of exclusivity. That doesn't seem to work so much anymore. Lots of people just want to buy nice houses without having to pay golf club fees. And hard core golfers don't necessarily want to be tied to one course. So new homes on a golf course aren't the selling point they once were. And subdivisions that were built around courses are finding that the course is bleeding money so some are plowing them up and replacing them with homes and ordinary green spaces and trails.

There is also a very big regional thing with golf. When lived in Texas I had teacher friends who golfed so I ended up picking up a set of cheap Costco clubs to join them. Texas (at least Central Texas) has very little open public space so if you want to get outdoors your options are limited, and golfing is one of the ways to do that. There were a bunch of courses around Waco, for example, two fancy country club type courses and the rest were modest municipal courses or modest family-run operations. So golfing was a good way to get out and do a hike in the fresh air with friends on a Saturday morning. I would always do walking riding golf carts which is a better way to get exercise but seems to annoy everyone else on a crowded day as people in carts would pile up behind you and you'd have to wave them through. The whole idea of riding around in a motorized cart makes it less of a sport. Golf carts aren't part of the professional game.

Here in the Pacific Northwest there are vastly more options for getting outdoors. Lots more parks and trails and wilderness areas so I haven't gotten my clubs out even once. And I don't even know anyone who golfs. It isn't much fun to golf alone (compared to say biking alone) unless all you do is go to the driving range and just hammer balls.

Either way, it is a fairly expensive and resource-intensive sport and pretty extravagant when you consider all the money it takes to keep up a golf course. So it really isn't my thing. But if we still lived back in Texas I'd probably still be doing it just because of the lack of other options for getting outdoors.

There was a big blip upwards in golf during the heart of the pandemic when it was one of the few ways to get outside and things like indoor gyms were closed. But that seems to have passed and it is declining again. Who knows. There might also be a reverse Trump effect as younger people don't want to do something so closely associated with Trump.

[Josh]

Country clubs around here keep either closing or having rather desperate membership drives. The young rich just don't seem to be interested in joining.

There are tons and tons of golf courses (it's not very expensive to go play a quick game of 9 holes either). Gradually, they are getting sold enough and redeveloped into masses of housing (Ken will be delighted to hear most of it is "multifamily" housing).

[Ken]

Country clubs around here keep either closing or having rather desperate membership drives. The young rich just don't seem to be interested in joining.

There are tons and tons of golf courses (it's not very expensive to go play a quick game of 9 holes either). Gradually, they are getting sold enough and redeveloped into masses of housing (Ken will be delighted to hear most of it is "multifamily" housing).

Same here. Golf courses are closing as are country clubs. Today's wealthy are much more global than local. Rich want to vacation and weekend in places like Aspen or Nantucket or have weekend homes in Costa Rica rather than hang out at the local country club.

I don't much care what happens in rural Ohio. If you want to turn your golf courses into soybean fields that's fine too. I just don't think there should be zoning and regulatory barriers to increased housing and higher density in places where there is a housing shortage and demand for it.

[Sudsy]

What are some of the impediments that prevent a seeker from admission to an Anabaptist fellowship?
Negative speech and insults?
Cynicism?
Refusal to obey the tenets of the group?

Some things I have compiled.

https://churchplantersforum.org/wp-cont ... urches.pdf

Quite an interesting document Ernie. Lots here to ponder. Will read again. Thankyou.

[MaxPC]

If you want to maintain your relationships, you gotta go with the flow.

Or you just don’t go with the flow.

Free will and the decision to be separate from worldly influences and activities.

[MaxPC]

What are some of the impediments that prevent a seeker from admission to an Anabaptist fellowship?
Negative speech and insults?
Cynicism?
Refusal to obey the tenets of the group?

Some things I have compiled.

https://churchplantersforum.org/wp-cont ... urches.pdf

Ernie, I do appreciate this document you provided. I found it enlightening. My wife and I discussed your findings and interestingly, we agree that the same behavioral observations can be said of ethnic Catholics in small parishes. The similarities of perceived behaviors are striking.

[Judas Maccabeus]

What are some of the impediments that prevent a seeker from admission to an Anabaptist fellowship?
Negative speech and insults?
Cynicism?
Refusal to obey the tenets of the group?

Some things I have compiled.

https://churchplantersforum.org/wp-cont ... urches.pdf

Do you think that an NMB walking into a church plant stands a better chance of success, as a strong cultural tradition has not yet formed?

[eccentric_rambler]

Do you think that an NMB walking into a church plant stands a better chance of success, as a strong cultural tradition has not yet formed?

Probably. Depends a bit on if it was started as an outreach and attracted outreach-minded people or if it started as a farmland acquisition opportunity.

[Josh]

Do you think that an NMB walking into a church plant stands a better chance of success, as a strong cultural tradition has not yet formed?

Probably. Depends a bit on if it was started as an outreach and attracted outreach-minded people or if it started as a farmland acquisition opportunity.

Even in the latter, it can be easier for a community person to “slip in”. There are a couple of examples of these in our own circles.

By numbers, surprisingly, the largest number of outsiders who have joined and stayed (often with multigenerational families) are at the big, well established churches in “strongholds” like central Michigan or Kansas.