Questions for Catholics and Orthodox

[Ernie]

Have a question you would like to ask a Catholic or Orthodox?

This is a place you can do it.

Please do not answer questions if you are not Catholic or Orthodox.

[Ernie]

To Catholics:

Why do you believe the Orthodox church was in the wrong, for not staying with the Roman Catholic church?


If I understand correctly, Catholics do not believe Orthodox to be heretical. Is that correct?

[Ernie]

To the Orthodox

I understand that the Orthodox church believes some Catholic doctrines to be heretical. If the Roman Catholic church would drop those beliefs you consider to be heretical, is that all it would take, from your perspective, for the Catholic church to again be united with the Orthodox?

[MaxPC]

Excellent question and thread, Ernie. My mobile signal is still dodgy and the answer to your questions are a bit more complex than I can type quickly presently.

Nevertheless the different branches of Orthodoxy are not in the same page with each other. The RCC did hold several ecumenical meetings some time ago with representatives of the various Orthodox branches. It was an initiative authored by Pope John Paul II who stated that the body of Christ must breathe with both lungs. He sought to heal the wounds and make peace as did his successor, Pope Benedict XVI. Losing signal again so will continue this tomorrow.

[barnhart]

How do you understand the New Testament warnings against creating hierarchies of power?
Matt 20:25-29
Matt 23:8-10
1Pet 5:3

[MaxPC]

Excellent question and thread, Ernie. My mobile signal is still dodgy and the answer to your questions are a bit more complex than I can type quickly presently.

Nevertheless the different branches of Orthodoxy are not in the same page with each other. The RCC did hold several ecumenical meetings some time ago with representatives of the various Orthodox branches. It was an initiative authored by Pope John Paul II who stated that the body of Christ must breathe with both lungs. He sought to heal the wounds and make peace as did his successor, Pope Benedict XVI. Losing signal again so will continue this tomorrow.

Ernie did this give you a better idea of the current relations between the RCC and the Orthodox branches? I had started to do a detailed explanation of the historical points of disagreement but that would not only have been tedious it would have only served to rehash the past, rather than look at the current state of the matter and the progress in reconciliation that has been made.

Why do you believe the Orthodox church was in the wrong, for not staying with the Roman Catholic church?
I do not think they were in the wrong. I do believe that there were certain linguistic and cultural misunderstandings bound tightly in the politics of that time. In point of fact the series of RCC/Orthodox meetings in the early 2000s produced congenial agreements and mutual understanding on a number of topics and we are no longer in disagreement on a number of those issues. Politics and cultural misunderstandings can fade with time and a newly enlightened heart of Christian discipleship.

One note: the Russian Orthodox who had been invited to these ecumenical summits did send delegates but when the delegates of the Greek Orthodox arrived, the Russians stood up and stormed out of the room; they did not return. Therefore the Russian Orthodox were not a part of the agreements reached as they had returned to Russia.

If I understand correctly, Catholics do not believe Orthodox to be heretical. Is that correct?

Correct. They were/are considered "separated brethren". The RCC also refers to Anabaptists as "our separated brethren".

[MaxPC]

How do you understand the New Testament warnings against creating hierarchies of power?
Matt 20:25-29
Matt 23:8-10
1Pet 5:3

Barnhart, in order to avoid confusion on definitions, it would help me to understand and answer your query if I have more information.
How does your fellowship understand these verses?
Does your fellowship have bishops? Elders? Deacons?
How do those verses impact those positions in your fellowship?

[Soloist]

Can you post a link to where the Anabaptist are called separated brethren? There is very little I see outside of an interfaith discussion which ultimately didn’t conclude anything other then “we need to discuss the disagreement we had back then”

[MaxPC]

Can you post a link to where the Anabaptist are called separated brethren? There is very little I see outside of an interfaith discussion which ultimately didn’t conclude anything other then “we need to discuss the disagreement we had back then”

My internet is dodgy since the storms and AT&T outage. MN comes up but a number of other sites are not linking yet. Here is the relevant reference.
The Catechism of the Catholic Church: Part Two; Section Two; Chapter One; Article 3; Subsection VI; Paragraphs 1399-1400.

[Soloist]

ART TWO: THE CELEBRATION OF THE CHRISTIAN MYSTERY
SECTION TWO THE SEVEN SACRAMENTS OF THE CHURCH
CHAPTER ONE THE SACRAMENTS OF CHRISTIAN INITIATION
Article 3 THE SACRAMENT OF THE EUCHARIST
VI. The Paschal Banquet

https://www.vatican.va/archive/ENG0015/__P42.HTM

1399 The Eastern churches that are not in full communion with the Catholic Church celebrate the Eucharist with great love. "These Churches, although separated from us, yet possess true sacraments, above all - by apostolic succession - the priesthood and the Eucharist, whereby they are still joined to us in closest intimacy." A certain communion in sacris, and so in the Eucharist, "given suitable circumstances and the approval of Church authority, is not merely possible but is encouraged."235

1400 Ecclesial communities derived from the Reformation and separated from the Catholic Church, "have not preserved the proper reality of the Eucharistic mystery in its fullness, especially because of the absence of the sacrament of Holy Orders."236 It is for this reason that Eucharistic intercommunion with these communities is not possible for the Catholic Church. However these ecclesial communities, "when they commemorate the Lord's death and resurrection in the Holy Supper . . . profess that it signifies life in communion with Christ and await his coming in glory."237

I see nothing calling Anabaptist separated brethren.
If anything, it says that since the Eastern Orthodox have hands laid on them dating back to the apostles (their claim, not mine) they are in close unity.
The reformers on the other hand, have no priests (if I'm understanding the reference to Holy Orders correct) cannot have eucharistic intercommunion with the Catholics. I see nothing about referring to them as brothers. I see a nod to anyone who is not in the Catholic church but agrees with it being allowed

1401 When, in the Ordinary's judgment, a grave necessity arises, Catholic ministers may give the sacraments of Eucharist, Penance, and Anointing of the Sick to other Christians not in full communion with the Catholic Church, who ask for them of their own will, provided they give evidence of holding the Catholic faith regarding these sacraments and possess the required dispositions.238

but nothing about calling them brothers or any fellowship.

Are you referring to this section or were you meaning to quote something else?
Has there been anything outside of this generalized statement that refers to the Anabaptist or Mennonites as separated brethren?