War in Gaza

Things that are not part of politics happening presently and how we approach or address it as Anabaptists.
RZehr
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Re: War in Gaza

Post by RZehr »

Robert wrote: Sun Apr 07, 2024 9:26 am Image

With coast line like they have, they could have wonderful resorts and all kinds of tourist money. International money flows in like crazy. Yet, they build bombs with pipelines and blame others for their struggles.

As in North Korea, they have been taught that their struggles are from their enemies. The leadership props up their enemies and convinces everyone that it is all the enemy's fault. This is why 80% of Gaza supports Hamas. The truth is far from that.
They could also have made friends with Egypt and have a route out. But they are so violent and have such a murderous purpose that they can not. Even Israel has managed to have relationships with Egypt now, and the two have had war, and are fundamentally opposed to each other. Yet the two have managed to act like adults towards each other.
Hamas is crazy.
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Bootstrap
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Re: War in Gaza

Post by Bootstrap »

Robert wrote: Sun Apr 07, 2024 9:26 am Image

With coast line like they have, they could have wonderful resorts and all kinds of tourist money. International money flows in like crazy. Yet, they build bombs with pipelines and blame others for their struggles.
They could if Israel let them. Israel's land, sea and air blockade severely restricted who could get in and out and what goods could get in and out. See:

The Gaza Strip | The humanitarian impact of 15 years of blockade - June 2022
Robert wrote: Sun Apr 07, 2024 9:26 amAs in North Korea, they have been taught that their struggles are from their enemies. The leadership props up their enemies and convinces everyone that it is all the enemy's fault. This is why 80% of Gaza supports Hamas. The truth is far from that.
Most Gazans are, in fact, refugees because Israel took their land. Israel's blockade has made it very hard to have an economy, resulting in a great deal of unemployment and poverty.

None of that justifies what happened on October 7th. But most Gazans have no idea what actually happened on October 7th - their news sources have been just as biased as Israel's, and they do not know about the atrocities that Hamas committed. Each side is also reluctant to believe that their side does wrong.

And the high level of support for Hamas now has a lot to do with Israel effectively destroying civilian life in Gaza, including most homes and medical facilities. In Gaza, people are trying to survive day-to-day under horrible conditions. I think both Hamas and Israel are to blame for this.
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Thomas_muntzer
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Re: War in Gaza

Post by Thomas_muntzer »

The best recruiting campaign for hamas is every time the IDF bombs a hospital or school
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RZehr
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Re: War in Gaza

Post by RZehr »

This is weird.
Germany to give Holocaust survivors $236 payout to help them cope with October 7 attacks

https://www.yahoo.com/news/germany-holo ... 48718.html
Why.
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Ernie
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Re: War in Gaza

Post by Ernie »

80 years from now, might Israel be giving Gazan survivors a few hundred dollars, whenever Gazans are attacked by Egypt or some other political entity?
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RZehr
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Re: War in Gaza

Post by RZehr »

It smells bad to me. I can’t tell what I’m smelling, though it smells like a cross between virtue signaling and … grievance politics? I don’t know… Sure give them money, I don’t care. But it’s so little, why bother? And the timing is so weird. If there was a need for this, why not 12 months ago? And it sort feels like it removes the blame, or at least the attention, from Hamas -which is where it belongs - to…Germany? White savior complex much? It’s like celebrities changing their avatars in light of a tragedy, and making it about themselves by injecting themselves into the limelight. Yes Germany, we know you were bad to the Jews too. But today you aren’t, and you can go now.

I guess also, I think things like the Holocaust need to be forgiven. Not keep being brought up.
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Ken
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Re: War in Gaza

Post by Ken »

RZehr wrote: Fri Apr 12, 2024 2:20 pm This is weird.
Germany to give Holocaust survivors $236 payout to help them cope with October 7 attacks

https://www.yahoo.com/news/germany-holo ... 48718.html
Why.
I clicked through to the article and it turns out they are talking about the 113,000 Holocaust survivors living in ISRAEL. And not Holocaust survivors who are German citizens living in Germany. Which makes the whole thing doubly weird.

I guess Germany can do whatever it wants. But I fail to understand the underlying context of this. I guess Germany does ultimately have guilt for the Holocaust in the first place. So this is could be part of that. But frankly, Germany should be paying them for the things that GERMANY did, not for the things that Hamas did. Which wasn't actually targeted at Holocaust survivors. I don't know if any Holocaust survivors were killed or kidnapped on 10/7 but I sort of doubt it or we would have heard about it already.
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Ernie
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Re: War in Gaza

Post by Ernie »

Is this true?

https://www.israelam.com/israel-news-4-1-24/
According to the Israeli authority coordinating humanitarian aid deliveries to Gaza, between 150 and 200 aid trucks enter Gaza every day. UN agencies and aid organizations operating in Gaza are unable to cope with the volume of supplies brought in by trucks every day, with hundreds of trucks waiting on the Gazan side of the Kerem Shalom crossing for distribution by aid bodies at any given moment. Food prices have been cut in half. There appears to be an abundance of food in the markets. [of course, the world still accuses Israel of causing famine in Gaza.]
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ken_sylvania
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Re: War in Gaza

Post by ken_sylvania »

Ernie wrote: Sat Apr 13, 2024 8:23 pm Is this true?

https://www.israelam.com/israel-news-4-1-24/
According to the Israeli authority coordinating humanitarian aid deliveries to Gaza, between 150 and 200 aid trucks enter Gaza every day. UN agencies and aid organizations operating in Gaza are unable to cope with the volume of supplies brought in by trucks every day, with hundreds of trucks waiting on the Gazan side of the Kerem Shalom crossing for distribution by aid bodies at any given moment. Food prices have been cut in half. There appears to be an abundance of food in the markets. [of course, the world still accuses Israel of causing famine in Gaza.]
My opinion:

Just because the aid has gotten across the border doesn't mean it's available in the markets.

Israel's statement that "We've done our job, it's time for the UN to step up and do their job of delivering the aid" seems a bit ridiculous. Israel busted up Gaza, how do they figure it's the UN's job to distribute aid? I thought it's supposed to be the occupying power's job to do that.
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Ernie
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Re: War in Gaza

Post by Ernie »

I'm trying to sort fact from fiction...
What parts of this article are true, what is false, and what is misleading?

https://reliefweb.int/report/occupied-p ... april-2024

Is there any hard evidence that Israel is trying to starve Gazans?

Or

Does Israel simply care more about their military objectives than about the lives of Gazans, so whenever push comes to shove, Gazans end up getting killed or starved?
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The old woodcutter spoke again. “It is impossible to talk with you. You always draw conclusions. Life is so vast, yet you judge all of life with one page or one word. You see only a fragment. Unless you know the whole story, how can you judge?"
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