Russia Invades Ukraine 2022

[Martin]

“Pope says Ukraine should have 'courage of the white flag' of negotiations”
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/po ... 024-03-09/

“Ukraine rejects pope’s call to ‘raise the white flag’ to end Russia’s war”
The Catholic leader, 87, told a Swiss broadcaster that Ukraine should negotiate with Russia and raised the idea of surrender.
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/3/1 ... ith-russia

i wish Z had had the foresight to accept DJT’s advice to “find a way” to negotiate with Russia.
He chose to follow the “siren’s song” of the Left West. Promises, promises.

He+Ukraine might have been better off in every way.
Pope Francis would not be counseling about the courage of white flags.

Why isn't the pope telling Russia to raise the white flag and go home?

In any event, It isn't Ukraine that is rejecting anything. It is Russia. This is from Russian State TV today

Maybe the pope is senile? His comments are bizarre considering Russia is the invader.

[temporal1]

Maybe the pope is senile? His comments are bizarre considering Russia is the invader.

Did he suggest he wasn’t aware of who initiated? Or that it should be forgotten?
(i think) Pope Francis has been consistent over years about counseling toward peace (?)
My impression, i don’t follow closely.

Matthew 5:44
https://biblehub.com/matthew/5-44.htm

43You have heard that it was said, ‘Love your neighbor’ and ‘Hate your enemy.’

44But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,

45that you may be sons of your Father in heaven.
He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous.…

As i read this, scriptures are challenging beyond “white flag surrender” to literal love.
God must think very highly of our potential.

Pope Francis is 87. He can be confusing. i don’t sense it’s from senility.
i don’t follow closely.

[temporal1]

Bullying, threatening to pull out and making positive statements about NATO enemies doesn't look like strengthening NATO to me.

HIs first term, he demanded they spend more. Many did. Some not tot he level of the agreement, but they did increase. He did that by stating it was not important and threatening to pull out. The other nation states increased their defense spending to quiet him. I did not like the tactics, but they worked. I did not like the goal, but he moved the other nations to more support.

It was just the opposite of the Abraham Accords, which I really liked and want to see develop more.

I think all the posturing against Russia is stupid.
No. They are not the greatest, but they could have been more ally then enemy.
The USA overthrew an elected leader in Ukraine just to get someone in that was more supportive of the USA.
The Ukraine war is just as much the US fault as Russia, if not more.

Questions asked and overwhelmingly rejected from the start. Asked by leading international diplomats. Noted throughout this forum topic.

[temporal1]

^^Quotes above reference Trump’s 2016-2020 presidency.

[Ernie]

Well... Putin thinks it is "complete nonsense" that Russia might attack a NATO country.
https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukrai ... 2193e83f50

But I'm remembering that Putin said there would be no invasion... And then after he invaded he said there would be no occupation... So...
www.npr.org/2022/01/10/1071766987/u-s-r ... frontation
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/russia-ukr ... tion-plan/

[Ken]

Well... Putin thinks it is "complete nonsense" that Russia might attack a NATO country.
https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukrai ... 2193e83f50

Which is Putin himself providing the most compelling reason for why the Baltic States and other eastern European countries all wanted to to join NATO, including Ukraine.

Because he certainly doesn't have any such reservation when it comes to non-NATO countries.

[mike]

The Polish PM said he feels Europe is in a pre-war situation.

Today we have to spend as much as we can to buy equipment and ammunition for Ukraine, because we are living in the most critical moment since the end of the Second World War," he said. "The next two years will decide everything. If we cannot support Ukraine with enough equipment and ammunition, if Ukraine loses, no one in Europe will be able to feel safe.

I don't know. It certainly is not a great situation, and if I were in Poland or another adjacent nation, the idea of a wider war would be one of my nightmares.

[Josh]

The Polish PM said he feels Europe is in a pre-war situation.

Today we have to spend as much as we can to buy equipment and ammunition for Ukraine, because we are living in the most critical moment since the end of the Second World War," he said. "The next two years will decide everything. If we cannot support Ukraine with enough equipment and ammunition, if Ukraine loses, no one in Europe will be able to feel safe.

I don't know. It certainly is not a great situation, and if I were in Poland or another adjacent nation, the idea of a wider war would be one of my nightmares.

Perhaps Poland should consider how to have warmer relation with its neighbours instead of getting itself into wars that it can’t win over and over.

[temporal1]

The Polish PM said he feels Europe is in a pre-war situation.

Today we have to spend as much as we can to buy equipment and ammunition for Ukraine, because we are living in the most critical moment since the end of the Second World War," he said. "The next two years will decide everything. If we cannot support Ukraine with enough equipment and ammunition, if Ukraine loses, no one in Europe will be able to feel safe.

I don't know. It certainly is not a great situation, and if I were in Poland or another adjacent nation, the idea of a wider war would be one of my nightmares.

Perhaps Poland should consider how to have warmer relation with its neighbours instead of getting itself into wars that it can’t win over and over.

2 more years? $200-300+ Billion U.S. more? What will be left of Ukraine,either way?
This is all speculation, possibly fear-mongering, all just happens to result in “hundreds of billions MORE,” or the end of the world.

2016 Trump as POTUS was supposed to be the end of the world, to add to the list of many other such predictions.
Many discussed on MD.

people love to be made fearful. fear sells.

[Szdfan]

The Polish PM said he feels Europe is in a pre-war situation.

Today we have to spend as much as we can to buy equipment and ammunition for Ukraine, because we are living in the most critical moment since the end of the Second World War," he said. "The next two years will decide everything. If we cannot support Ukraine with enough equipment and ammunition, if Ukraine loses, no one in Europe will be able to feel safe.

I don't know. It certainly is not a great situation, and if I were in Poland or another adjacent nation, the idea of a wider war would be one of my nightmares.

Perhaps Poland should consider how to have warmer relation with its neighbours instead of getting itself into wars that it can’t win over and over.

That is a terrible take. Throughout its history, Poland got into wars it couldn't win by merely existing.