Plain Politics and the Two Kingdoms

[barnhart]

I like the article, but I fear distilling this worldview down to a "two kingdom" doctrine. From my observation that drifts rather quickly toward a Lutheran style two kingdom theory, (right hand Kingdom and left hand Kingdom as he called it) where each is equally ordained for divine purpose and each has a valid claim on the believer, Jesus and his kingdom for the soul and the kingdoms of this world for everything else you value (culture, family, nation, possessions, jobs ect...). I think of it a Kingdom centered theology because there is only one that matters, the rest are small details.

[AnthonyMartin]

I like the article, but I fear distilling this worldview down to a "two kingdom" doctrine. From my observation that drifts rather quickly toward a Lutheran style two kingdom theory, (right hand Kingdom and left hand Kingdom as he called it) where each is equally ordained for divine purpose and each has a valid claim on the believer, Jesus and his kingdom for the soul and the kingdoms of this world for everything else you value (culture, family, nation, possessions, jobs ect...). I think of it a Kingdom centered theology because there is only one that matters, the rest are small details.

If I may, some of this seems inconsistent with past positions you've described.

I agree with your premise of a single Kingdom ruling over all. With your past discussions on the matter I have never interpreted you to consider the rest as "small details". In fact, earthly governments (the avoidance and shunning thereof) seem to be the main detail in the majority of your Kingdom discussions.

[barnhart]

Well, we can all aim to be better than we are in practice.

[joshuabgood]

Individuals should be able to make their own health choices, while showing respect for others who make different health choices.

I am curious about this one also Ernie. How does that apply to things like masks? Smoking? Vaccines? Obesity? Enabling obese children...etc

[Josh]

Individuals should be able to make their own health choices, while showing respect for others who make different health choices.

I am curious about this one also Ernie. How does that apply to things like masks? Smoking? Vaccines? Obesity? Enabling obese children...etc

Masks are a fashion choice and obedience to government choice, not a “health choice”.

Smoking is living a carnal lifestyle, which Christians recognized long before we knew md health issues.

[Dan Z]

I think this is an important statement and needs to be made. Well done Plain News (Ernie and Mike Atnip). I hope the message is heard among the plain people. For the moment I fear we are loosing the battle. At stake is so much more than political entanglement...politics create worldview...in the plain community this is a battle for the mind of Christ as opposed to the carnal ideologies of political power (right or left).

I'd just add that I appreciate Barnhart's caution that we not become to comfortable with a two-kingdom balance in the world. Ultimately, according to the prophets, there will be no end to the limit of Christ's government of peace. The apostles tell us that God will ultimately put "all- things" under his feet, that "all things will become new," that every nation, tribe and tongue will confess his lordship - and as Christ himself prayed, His Kingdom will come on Earth as it is in Heaven. In other words, two-kingdom theology is not a steady-state arrangement, but a temporary context on the way to One-Kingdom reality.

[Wade]

I thought Christ was clear that His kingdom is not of this world and that only certain people can even see or enter it. The thoughts about one kingdom or two earthly kingdoms/Lutheran ideas are so far off from the simple words of Christ it seems really odd...

[joshuabgood]

I thought Christ was clear that His kingdom is not of this world and that only certain people can even see or enter it. The thoughts about one kingdom or two earthly kingdoms/Lutheran ideas are so far off from the simple words of Christ it seems really odd...

When he said his kingdom is not of this world he means it is not a worldly kingdom. It doesn't operate like worldly kingdoms.

He doesn't mean that it doesn't exist on earth as a present reality. He prayed for the coming of his kingdom on earth.

[Wade]

I thought Christ was clear that His kingdom is not of this world and that only certain people can even see or enter it. The thoughts about one kingdom or two earthly kingdoms/Lutheran ideas are so far off from the simple words of Christ it seems really odd...

When he said his kingdom is not of this world he means it is not a worldly kingdom. It doesn't operate like worldly kingdoms.

He doesn't mean that it doesn't exist on earth as a present reality. He prayed for the coming of his kingdom on earth.

Of course it is present reality He said to repent for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. And that it is in you. And peace, righteousness, and joy in the Holy ghost.

[Ernie]

Individuals should be able to make their own health choices, while showing respect for others who make different health choices.

I am curious about this one also Ernie. How does that apply to things like masks? Smoking? Vaccines? Obesity? Enabling obese children...etc

Our nation still allows its citizens 18 and older to forego health treatments that they don't want. I think this is the way it should be. It can be hard sometimes to convince healthcare workers of this fact, but it can be done.

I wear an N95 mask sent to me by friends in China for my own protection. Whenever I don't think I need that protection, I still wear a cloth mask as a kindness to those who don't want to breath larger size droplets that I exhale.

Our nation still allows smoking, but makes regulations so that those of us who don't want to breath smoke don't have to. If a person followed Jesus' teachings, he wouldn't smoke around those who don't want to breathe it. (Golden Rule)
But not everyone cares about Jesus' teachings so the government needs to make laws to protect its citizens from harm.

A small percentage of the population can avoid vaccines and it will not create a pandemic or overwhelm the healthcare system. But if this percentage gets too large, it can cause unnecessary troubles for others. An anti-vaxer Christian needs to weigh whether the risks associated with getting vaccines outweigh the damage he may cause for society. (his neighbors)

My dad greatly reduced his selection of sweets at his grocery store, because he didn't want to encourage obesity.