White Settlement Texas Church Shooting

[mike]

I have a hard time reconciling an Anabaptist church that would cite biblical authority to argue picayune details about women's dress, head coverings, shoes, buttons, fabric patterns, etc. But then welcome firearms into the sanctuary.

So is there actually such an Anabaptist church out there? I've never heard of this.

[gcdonner]

I have a hard time reconciling an Anabaptist church that would cite biblical authority to argue picayune details about women's dress, head coverings, shoes, buttons, fabric patterns, etc. But then welcome firearms into the sanctuary.

So is there actually such an Anabaptist church out there? I've never heard of this.

There might be some USMC churches???

[ohio jones]

I have a hard time reconciling an Anabaptist church that would cite biblical authority to argue picayune details about women's dress, head coverings, shoes, buttons, fabric patterns, etc. But then welcome firearms into the sanctuary.

So is there actually such an Anabaptist church out there? I've never heard of this.

There might be some USMC churches???

Yes, United States Marine Corps churches would meet this description, all except the Anabaptist part.

Just in case you actually meant MCUSA, they are not into those picayune details, and most would get up in arms about the presence of firearms. Some are not really into biblical authority, either.

[gcdonner]

So is there actually such an Anabaptist church out there? I've never heard of this.

There might be some USMC churches???

Yes, United States Marine Corps churches would meet this description, all except the Anabaptist part.

Just in case you actually meant MCUSA, they are not into those picayune details, and most would get up in arms about the presence of firearms. Some are not really into biblical authority, either.

Yeah, I meant MCUSA, but I get it mixed up with the ULCA and with a couple of other abbreviations added in who knows who anyone is talking about anymore??? But perhaps USMC was the most accurate abbreviation????

[Josh]

The UK has a rather ugly violence epidemic despite strict gun laws. Gun laws don’t change men’s violent hearts, and are only as good as a police state to enforce them. The cops still have to carry and shoot the guns.

[Ken]

I have a hard time reconciling an Anabaptist church that would cite biblical authority to argue picayune details about women's dress, head coverings, shoes, buttons, fabric patterns, etc. But then welcome firearms into the sanctuary.

So is there actually such an Anabaptist church out there? I've never heard of this.

I was responding to Ohio Jones' comment. Perhaps I misunderstood him. He said:

If some of those not-in-vain sword-bearers want to attend our churches to protect us from whatever, we should let them. If they do, we should make sure they hear about the Kingdom that has better armor than theirs. And pray that some of them eventually start bringing plowshares and pruning hooks to church.

[ohio jones]

I have a hard time reconciling an Anabaptist church that would cite biblical authority to argue picayune details about women's dress, head coverings, shoes, buttons, fabric patterns, etc. But then welcome firearms into the sanctuary.

So is there actually such an Anabaptist church out there? I've never heard of this.

I was responding to Ohio Jones' comment. Perhaps I misunderstood him. He said:

If some of those not-in-vain sword-bearers want to attend our churches to protect us from whatever, we should let them. If they do, we should make sure they hear about the Kingdom that has better armor than theirs. And pray that some of them eventually start bringing plowshares and pruning hooks to church.

Mike has been reading my sometimes obscure posts long enough to get pretty good at interpreting them.

I didn't say there was such a church, but that there should be. And if I'm defining what a church should be like, I wouldn't include arguing about picayune details, at least not on those subjects.

[Judas Maccabeus]

The UK has a rather ugly violence epidemic despite strict gun laws. Gun laws don’t change men’s violent hearts, and are only as good as a police state to enforce them. The cops still have to carry and shoot the guns.

But alas, far less often. There you may run into knives, but they have far shorter range. Running does work with knives, although at my age, far less effective.

At least by my observation, and I was in the UK 3 months ago, most officers do not appear to be armed with guns, although I would not want to tangle with those nightsticks.

J.M.

[Ken]

The UK has a rather ugly violence epidemic despite strict gun laws. Gun laws don’t change men’s violent hearts, and are only as good as a police state to enforce them. The cops still have to carry and shoot the guns.

But alas, far less often. There you may run into knives, but they have far shorter range. Running does work with knives, although at my age, far less effective.

At least by my observation, and I was in the UK 3 months ago, most officers do not appear to be armed with guns, although I would not want to tangle with those nightsticks.

J.M.

The firearm murder rate in the UK is 0.06 per 100,000. Which is on par with other northern European countries and Japan. The firearm murder rate in the US is 4.46 per 100,000 or 74-times higher. In other words, 74 Americans are killed by guns for every Brit when adjusted for population.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... death_rate

If you want to measure overall murder rates then the UK has an overall murder rate of 1.02 per 100,000 while the US has an overall murder rate of 5.30 per 100,000 or 5-times higher. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_c ... icide_rate The majority of murders in any country are domestic violence and personal disputes (killer and victim know each other). So in the UK as in the US it is mostly husbands killing their wives, that sort of thing. Stranger murders are rare everywhere. And mass shootings are exceedingly rare everywhere but the US.

So yes, however you want to measure it, the UK is many times safer than the US. As are all the countries of western and northern Europe. And all the developed countries in Asia are even safer (Japan, Korea, Singapore, etc.)

The US may lack the cultural and political will to do anything about the gun violence crisis in this country. But to simply wave ones hands and say it is just the consequence of human nature and there is nothing we can do is simply wrong as the rest of the civilized world has proven.

[MaxPC]

Is that possible? The Bible says lawful authority that “does not bear the sword in vain” is mandated by God.

Josh, I agree with you. We humans cannot “make a society where this unnecessary”. History tells us that has been tried and failed for thousands of years. Man is a sinful creature; and the fruits of societal engineering have always ended in the subjugation of one group or another because of that. It nearly always requires involvement in political processes that compromise a discipleship walk with God. God who is all-knowing, all powerful perfects our poor efforts in our walk with Him if we trust in Him alone, for we are only responsible for our own relationship with God.

Church and school shootings are not a thing in just about every other modern civilized society. So yes, it can be done. In fact it is the normal thing in western democracies.

That's an interesting claim, Ken. Do you have statistics for violent crimes (including knife attacks, rape, torture, etc.)? I can share that the UK does have a violence problem even if there are not as many guns involved. Violence is still violence. This is something that will always plague the human race because of sin.

Or perhaps you think the UK, Norway, New Zealand, etc. are authoritarian hellholes and Honduras, Venezuela, Somalia, Yemen, and other gun-drenched countries are models to be emulated.

Ken, you make an inaccurate assumption about my viewpoint. That is not what I said. If you will go back and reread my post carefully you will see I'm referencing historic patterns of human political legislation that attempt to exert too much social engineering over a group of people.