Soloist wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:56 pm
No endorsement on either side of the debate. I really just don't have the energy to keep discussing covid outside of my narrow focus.
Ivermectin was developed using fetal cells too, wasn't it? HEK-293, the same cells used to test the Moderna vaccination?
Is there any moral advantage to Ivermectin as opposed to vaccines?
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Soloist wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:56 pm
No endorsement on either side of the debate. I really just don't have the energy to keep discussing covid outside of my narrow focus.
Ivermectin was developed using fetal cells too, wasn't it? HEK-293, the same cells used to test the Moderna vaccination?
Is there any moral advantage to Ivermectin as opposed to vaccines?
No it was not developed using fetal cells. Ivermectin is an older medication.
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Soloist wrote: ↑Sun Sep 26, 2021 11:56 pm
No endorsement on either side of the debate. I really just don't have the energy to keep discussing covid outside of my narrow focus.
Ivermectin was developed using fetal cells too, wasn't it? HEK-293, the same cells used to test the Moderna vaccination?
Is there any moral advantage to Ivermectin as opposed to vaccines?
No it was not developed using fetal cells. Ivermectin is an older medication.
Ivermectin was developed in the late 1970s and was most certainly tested extensively with fetal stem cells, especially with respect to its use as a chemotherapy and anti-viral drug. Here’s just one example https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7505114/
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Ken wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 5:29 pm
Ivermectin was developed in the late 1970s and was most certainly tested extensively with fetal stem cells, especially with respect to its use as a chemotherapy and anti-viral drug. Here’s just one example https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7505114/
I haven't read all of these, but a quick Google for "Ivermectin" and "HEK-293" pulled up quite a few articles.
My initial impression is that the very same fetal cells used to test the Moderna vaccine were also used for the development of Ivermectin. But again, I haven't read these carefully.
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Ken wrote: ↑Mon Oct 18, 2021 5:29 pm
Ivermectin was developed in the late 1970s and was most certainly tested extensively with fetal stem cells, especially with respect to its use as a chemotherapy and anti-viral drug. Here’s just one example https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7505114/
I haven't read all of these, but a quick Google for "Ivermectin" and "HEK-293" pulled up quite a few articles.
My initial impression is that the very same fetal cells used to test the Moderna vaccine were also used for the development of Ivermectin. But again, I haven't read these carefully.
Ivermectin is a relatively simple chemical, and it hasn’t been tested with covid at all. No fetal stem cells have been involved in using ivermectin to treat or prevent covid.
Perhaps horse stem cells were used to test its potential as a horse dewormer?
Ivermectin was developed using fetal cells too, wasn't it? HEK-293, the same cells used to test the Moderna vaccination?
Is there any moral advantage to Ivermectin as opposed to vaccines?
No it was not developed using fetal cells. Ivermectin is an older medication.
Ivermectin was developed in the late 1970s and was most certainly tested extensively with fetal stem cells, especially with respect to its use as a chemotherapy and anti-viral drug. Here’s just one example https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7505114/
Looking over that article I don't see fetal cells listed. I see several cancer cell lines used, where do you see fetal cells used in it? can you quote it please?
As far as it goes, I never said that Ivermectin was never tested on fetal cells. I'm pointing out its ethical origin. If later its tested for broader use and that broader use is what you want to use it for, you need to wrestle that ethics yourself. I personally have no problem giving my animals ivermectin or using it for specific anti-parasite reasons.
I am neutral on using Ivermectin for Covid, I'm not educated enough to say if its effective or not. I only can point out that it was recommended for SARS and MERS back then.
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George W. Merck set the standard for his company when he announced, "We try to never forget that medicine is for the people. It is not for the profits. The profits follow, and if we remembered that, they have never failed to appear."
When Dr. Roy Vagelos led Merck decades later, he embodied that culture. Dr. Vagelos, a Chemistry major graduate from the University of Pennsylvania and a member of Phi Beta Kappa, he obtained his MD degree from Columbia University College of Physicians and Surgeons.
A child of Greek Immigrants, Dr. Vagelos considered himself a physician first, a scientist second, and a corporate businessman third. Roy learned about a drug that could eradicate a disease that was blinding millions of Africans. River Blindness was ranked the second most common cause of blindness in the world in 1987.
The tell-tale signs of an afflicted area were small groups of adults led by a rope or stick held by a child. These blind adults were dependent on their children anytime they needed to fetch water, use the bathroom, or prepare dinner. Children as young as two could be seen guiding adults with sticks.
Dr. Vagelos remained haunted by these scenes. “River Blindness occurs in Sub-Saharan Africa among the poorest of the poor. I will tell you, many of these people, whom my wife and I visited, live in mud huts, and have never left their village in their entire life. These people were being attacked by a parasitic worm. They crawl through the skin and get into the eyes and cause the eyes to become blind – and we had a drug that prevented that completely.”
When he learned that Ivermectin, a drug previously used to treat parasites in animals, could be effective in humans to treat River Blindness, he was more than intrigued. Moreover, only a single pill per year was necessary, and this drug cost mere pennies. The problem was that the poor African villagers could not even afford pennies. Nor could their impoverished governments.
Dr. Vagelos visited President Reagan's White House. He met with Don Reagan, Chief of Staff, and later with John Whitehead, Secretary of State, and asked the US government to fund the humanitarian effort. "While we would like to do this program, we can't afford it," as Dr. Vagelos wrote in his book, "Medicine, Science and Merck."
As a physician, first and foremost, Dr. Vagelos did the unthinkable. He offered to treat every person who required the Ivermectin for free - for as long as they needed it - all courtesy of the Merck Corporation.
Now in 2021, decades later, the Mectizan (Ivermectin) Program has expanded and blossomed, with participation by other sponsors, including The WHO and Gates Foundation. Thanks to Dr. Vagelos, the disease has been eradicated in Ecuador, Colombia, Mexico, and Guatemala. Merck has now donated more than one billion doses of Ivermectin and saved the sight of tens of millions of people.
Although George Merck passed away in 1957, he would have smiled upon Dr. Roy Vagelos for his bold and spectacular decision.
A UNESCO report from 2005 states, "The progress that has been made in combating the disease (river blindness) represents one of the most triumphant public health campaigns ever waged in the developing world.”
Dr. Vagelos has continued giving. He bestowed 250 million dollars to Columbia University's Medical School to help fund students' medical educations. In addition, he contributed 15 million dollars to the University of Pennsylvania to create the Roy and Diana Vagelos Laboratories, and he founded the Vagelos Scholars Program in Molecular Life Sciences. As the author of more than 100 scientific papers, Vagelos was given the NAS Award for Chemistry in Service to Society in 1995.
A tireless worker, the good doctor has served as the Chairman of Regeneron Pharmaceuticals since 1995, and he has nurtured the same moral compass there as he did at Merck. Regeneron's monoclonal antibody cocktail successfully treated President Donald Trump and received Emergency Use Authorization from the FDA in November of 2020.
The cocktail has been praised and utilized by Dr. Peter McCullough and Dr. George Fareed, pioneers in repurposed drugs to treat COVID-19.
In an interview at Columbia Business School on May 5, 2020, Dr. Valegos offered wisdom about the coronavirus pandemic.
The current issue with COVID-19 is the variants. The emerging new variants of the virus have a competitive advantage over the previous versions. The original Wuhan strain that the vaccine was developed against is no longer around. It is extinct. Today the Indian Delta Variant accounts for 99% of the cases in the United Kingdom and will soon become the dominant strain in the United States. With each new version, the virus becomes more infectious and less vulnerable to the vaccines.
Dr. John Campbell reported that nearly 10% of new Delta Variant hospitalized cases in the UK occurred in vaccinated persons. See the 6:00 mark.
We do not wish to wait another few months to encounter newer variants that will be even more resistant. If we could eradicate the virus quickly, no more variants could emerge. The evidence suggests that Ivermectin is effective against all the variants.
Dr. Vagelos discussed the problem of virus resistance.
His company solved this for AIDS when he used the combination approach – the idea of using three drugs in combination to prevent resistance from developing. This approach is remarkably similar to Dr. George Fareed’s and Dr. Peter McCullough’s multi-drug approach they have published and used so successfully to save almost all of their patients from COVID-19.
The combination of Ivermectin with Hydroxychloroquine, Doxycycline, and now Fluvoxamine has proven highly effective in observational trials. Dr. George Fareed and Dr. Brian Tyson treated and saved nearly 6,000 COVID-19 patients in California’s Imperial Valley using this approach.
A narrowly tailored single vaccine allows RNA viruses to mutate and evolve resistance, while the multi-drug cocktail prevents this. By simply adding Ivermectin to the vaccines, the world could quickly overcome the problem of variants in a matter of weeks. See the 8:12 mark.
“Ultimately, when you put a combination of three drugs together against a virus, the virus may become resistant to one, but it would be killed by one of the other two…If there are three drugs covering three important enzymes, the chances of that virus becoming resistant to all three is almost impossible…That’s what we’re looking at today, and the result that was achieved there is the result that I anticipate with the coronavirus.”
Ivermectin has proven itself to be safe throughout the Mectizan Donation Program. We know Ivermectin can effectively treat River Blindness. It has been almost completely eradicated worldwide, whereas it was once the second leading cause of blindness. See the 14:20 mark.
We know it is potent. One tiny pill is all that is required per year for effective treatment for River Blindness. In COVID-19, we read that Attorney Ralph Lorigo's court-ordered Ivermectin cases usually came off the ventilator after a single dose of the drug.
In India's recent deadly second pandemic surge, Ivermectin obliterated their crisis. Within weeks after the ICMR and AIIMS adopted Ivermectin, their cases are down 90% [414,188 to 42,640]. Those states with more aggressive Ivermectin use were down more dramatically; Daily cases in Goa, Uttarakhand, Uttar Pradesh, and Delhi were down 95%, 98%, 99%, 99%, respectively.
Dr. Kory and the FLCCC published a narrative review in the American Journal of Therapeutics in May 2021, showing the massive effectiveness of Ivermectin against COVID-19 in reducing death and cases. They concluded that it must be adopted globally immediately.
Dr. Tess Lawrie, a highly regarded WHO consultant and the British Ivermectin Development Panel, published a meta-analysis this month that came to a similar conclusion.
Former Director of Intellectual Property at Gilead Pharmaceuticals, Harvard-educated attorney, Brian Remy, wrote this about the necessity of implementing Ivermectin,
"It is simple - use what works and is most effective - period. Ivermectin used in combination with other therapeutics is a no-brainer and should be the standard of care for COVID-19. Not only would this be good for business and help avoid the criticism and bad PR, and potential civil/criminal liability for censorship, scientific misconduct, etc. for misrepresentation of Ivermectin and other generics, but most importantly it would save countless lives and end the pandemic for good."
Dr. Vagelos was asked if Merck benefitted from its 200 million dollar donation of Ivermectin for River Blindness. He answered, "The benefit (to Merck) was that we could recruit anyone in any part of the company – for decades. People love to work for a corporation who was willing to contribute a sight-saving drug to millions and millions of patients." See the 52:10 mark.
His magnificent program was taught in business schools across the nation as an example of corporate philanthropy. What a fine example it would be if Merck today repeated, and offered Ivermectin to end the COVID-19 Pandemic. Ivermectin and Merck could save the world.
As George W. Merck reminds us, "We try to never forget that medicine is for the people. It is not for the profits. The profits follow, and if we remembered that, they have never failed to appear."
i’m not familiar with The Desert Review, nor am i a medical person.
i have read this piece, but have not opened/viewed the several links within (yet). They appear differently than in the original report (first link above.)
“African with River Blindness guided by a child”
In Comments following the report, some are negative, some are positive.
Last edited by temporal1 on Sun Oct 24, 2021 1:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Most or all of this drama, humiliation, wasted taxpayer money could be spared -
with even modest attempt at presenting balanced facts from the start.
Twice in 2020, Dr. Pierre Kory was invited to testify to the United States Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs on the treatments he and his colleagues in the FLCCC Alliance were using successfully and recommending to health authorities and other medical professionals for use in combatting the coronavirus pandemic. Videos of his testimony can be viewed at the links below.
[FLCCC and Dr Kory (lung specialist) are mentioned in the above Desert News article.]
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Most or all of this drama, humiliation, wasted taxpayer money could be spared -
with even modest attempt at presenting balanced facts from the start.
Dr. Kory and the FLCCC published a narrative review in the American Journal of Therapeutics in May 2021, showing the massive effectiveness of Ivermectin against COVID-19 in reducing death and cases. They concluded that it must be adopted globally immediately.
