Using Scripture's terms and phrases

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Ernie
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Re: Using Scripture's terms and phrases

Postby Ernie » Wed Feb 15, 2017 4:24 pm

Hats Off wrote:I catch myself using words like "kids" and "cool" occasionally, but have also been known to advise against those terms. I don't understand why we would want or need to adopt this kind of language.


For many people, this kind of language is adopted by their parents before their time, so there is no adopting.
For others, it feels awkward to use terms that general society is not using so they adopt what general society does.

For a small minority, just because everyone else does it that way doesn't mean they have to. Consider Max Lucado's book, "If only I had a green nose."
(These folks are referred to variously as conservative, old order, Luddite, old-fashioned, out-of-date, behind-the-times, etc.)
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JimFoxvog
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Re: Using Scripture's terms and phrases

Postby JimFoxvog » Wed Feb 15, 2017 5:57 pm

Let's don't get into a discussion of the theory of evolution here, but language does change and evolve. The New Testament was written in the everyday language of the time. We will communicate better to many people with contemporary language, while some may be better reached with more archaic speech. Using Scripture's terms can help our thinking stay Godly, but it often helps to use the phraseology of modern translations and paraphrases. I think this is another good topic on which to apply the Romans 14 principle of not judging or criticizing one another and recognizing each is seeking God's glory.
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Josh
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Re: Using Scripture's terms and phrases

Postby Josh » Wed Feb 15, 2017 10:07 pm

Hats Off wrote:I catch myself using words like "kids" and "cool" occasionally, but have also been known to advise against those terms. I don't understand why we would want or need to adopt this kind of language.


Well, ultimately we could all just stick to speaking German, but then we will have difficulty being much of a witness to our unbelieving neighbours.
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KingdomBuilder
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Re: Using Scripture's terms and phrases

Postby KingdomBuilder » Wed Feb 15, 2017 10:39 pm

Do I think we should be using all the slang and lingo that's "in" ? No, not really. To know the current slang in itself would require a good deal of worldliness, usually. Obviously there are plenty of exceptions to this.
Do I think we should run about talking in a KJV-ish "ye olde" tongue? No.
I think talking in a respectable, dignified manner will get you far. Adding in scriptural terms and phrases is very important when talking about things related to the Faith- it establishes credibility and provides a witness.
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Bootstrap
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Re: Using Scripture's terms and phrases

Postby Bootstrap » Wed Feb 15, 2017 11:06 pm

I'm confused by the whole discussion of everyday use of terms like "kids" and "cool". When we use terms like that, we're not trying to express biblical concepts. In the OP, I was expressing a concern about things like how we understand the call of Christ or how we understand basic theology.

If we want to get back to the core of Scripture, maybe the whole distraction of "kids" vs. "children" is a distraction from that.
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Ernie
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Re: Using Scripture's terms and phrases

Postby Ernie » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:06 am

Bootstrap wrote:I'm confused by the whole discussion of everyday use of terms like "kids" and "cool". When we use terms like that, we're not trying to express biblical concepts. In the OP, I was expressing a concern about things like how we understand the call of Christ or how we understand basic theology.

If we want to get back to the core of Scripture, maybe the whole distraction of "kids" vs. "children" is a distraction from that.


True, but some translations start thinking we should use the words kids and cool since that is contemporary English. So there is a similar topic that is related here.
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JimFoxvog
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Re: Using Scripture's terms and phrases

Postby JimFoxvog » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:21 am

Ernie wrote:
True, but some translations start thinking we should use the words kids and cool since that is contemporary English. So there is a similar topic that is related here.


The Message does:

Proverbs 19.26 Kids who lash out against their parents are an embarrassment and disgrace. -- The Message


It doesn't bother me.
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Bootstrap
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Re: Using Scripture's terms and phrases

Postby Bootstrap » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:22 am

Ernie wrote:
Bootstrap wrote:I'm confused by the whole discussion of everyday use of terms like "kids" and "cool". When we use terms like that, we're not trying to express biblical concepts. In the OP, I was expressing a concern about things like how we understand the call of Christ or how we understand basic theology.

If we want to get back to the core of Scripture, maybe the whole distraction of "kids" vs. "children" is a distraction from that.


True, but some translations start thinking we should use the words kids and cool since that is contemporary English. So there is a similar topic that is related here.


Are there Bible translations that use the words "kids" and "cool"? Which ones?
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Neto
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Re: Using Scripture's terms and phrases

Postby Neto » Thu Feb 16, 2017 7:58 am

The KJV used what was apparently current idiom when they translated "May it not never be" as "God forbid". I suspect that in it's time it was a very "hip" translation. (But that time has passed.)
(Although some claim that the idiom in English originated from OT texts like 1 Sam. 24:6, where David says "Yahweh forbid that I should do such a thing ...". But if that were so, it would seem that the translators would have had Paul saying 'The Lord forbid', not 'God forbid'. I don't buy it.)
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Josh
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Re: Using Scripture's terms and phrases

Postby Josh » Thu Feb 16, 2017 8:13 am

A challenge is that "scripture's terms and phrases" are limited to the original text. The translator has to decide what new terms and phrases to use. I don't find anything beneficial about KJV's terms and phrases; for example, people often get confused about what the KJV means when it says heresies, conversation, or convenient, and I have met few people who can tell me what it means when it says "emulations".

A translation with terms like "cool" or "kids" seems perfectly acceptable to me, although "cool" is reserved for casual speech (which does exist in the Bible). "Kids" is the most common English word for the same meaning as German "Kinder".
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